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[gregor]

First of all i put this in this section since most comments on this topic are made here. If admins don't see it in that way, please move the thread according to your best judgement.

I see a lot of "it's still being sold" posts. but does anyone also take a look if the software is also supported? Can you get technical support for them?

"Abandonware is computer software which is no longer being sold or supported by its copyright holder."

Just as i suspected - programmes have to be supported (service) just like things that factories make and sell. Personally i can tell you that my factory considers 10 yearold applaince as abandoned. JUst ebcause we choosed to do so. After that time there is no guarantee for getting spare parts or tech support. However within the 10 years time full technical support is available. And i do believe this goes for services as well. Especially programmes.

Which opens another question. These days computers that you buy have preloaded Win XP. There should be support on how to make games (or programmes), made to work only in dos, work in todays systems. That's called technical support. And you have to offer it when you sell your product. Hence it appears if there is no more technical support you really can't sell it anymore. Because without special technical support the programme (game) doesne't work on today's computer systems.

An example would be a game i bought a long time ago called Terra Nova. It's a great game and has very cool movies. However later i bought better computer and uploaded WIN98 with FAT. The game didnt' work anymore because it seems that it only operates in DOS and FAT16. I immediatelly asked for official techsupport. They gave me some advices how to tweak my computer, but none of them worked. After a long while i learned a bit more about DOS, disk systems.... So i thought i would give it another try with some ideas prepared and some more questions (the game was still sold at the time). I tried to contact the support team again but they dind't exists anymore.

In my opinion that game should be abandoned as soon as it didn't work on my new PC. Just as most DOS games don't work on today's PC computer (the kinds you buy in stores) without propper tweaking programmes (Such as DOSBox).

Furthermore i seriously doubt that these games have included detailed instructions (a must in the EU to protect consumer) how to make them work on today's computers. Note that a lot of games have their system requirements specified as 486DX66Mhz or higher which means they MUST work on todays systems. Yet you all know very well that a lot of them don't work nowadays (some need moslo or similar). In fact there is a high chance that this kind of warez (edit: sorry i ment software here) is even illegal to sell because of this fact.

[Data]

well you can always choose to install dos as operating system.
then most games actually work.

The fact that the shops preconfigure your system with winxp doesn't change this. (that is the "fault" of the people who preinstall the stuff)

they probably do this to serve the avarage user. but the avarage user doesn't play games from 12 years ago.

[The Fifth Horseman]

Warez are always illegal.

If you mean that distributors should stop selling old games - try persuading them to and see what they answer.

[GraveDigger]

Warez are obscenely illegal, but a game that only runs in an obsolete operating system such as DOS doesn’t qualify as warez. I believe that if you have a good copy of such a game and provide it to someone who also owns it, but his or her disks are spoilt then such a gesture of yours must be honoured by the copyright holders as legal, and why? Because, they are not supporting the game anymore, even if it is sold in some game packs by some godforsaken third parties.

[gregor]

my point is that it's not enough for a game to be still sold. if it's sold but there is no supported provided for it - it means that it is abandoned. like any other merchandise.
Unless games are art by law definition (which i seriously doubt) it means that same rules apply for them as well as any other merchandise.

One might still have originals of Dune 2 and sell them, but the game no longer has support (mostly technical) and is hence abandoned.

that's what "abandon" means - no one is taking care of it anymore.

[dr_st]

That's why nobody really carez if you warez DOS gamez.

[BeefontheBone]

I think you're miseading that sentence - it's supposed to mean "neither sold nor supported," or at least that's how I usually interpret it. They tend to stop supporting it before they stop selling it, or rather the publishers stop supporting and selling it, but there are still copies for sale that they've already distributed to stores.

[Borodin]

Originally posted by gregor@May 5 2005, 08:47 AM
my point is that it's not enough for a game to be still sold. if it's sold but there is no supported provided for it - it means that it is abandoned. like any other merchandise.

Lack of support does not define who owns the game. If a company owns it, they still have the right to make money off it, even if they're no longer supporting it: their code, their game.

Legal ownership determines who has the rights. You can argue that lack of support constitutes lack of ownership in the courts if you'd like, but we all know beforehand you're going to get screwed. And it's a bit disingenuous, knowing that, to suggest this assumption to others.

[Omuletzu]

You're right borodin, but i think he(gregor) has a point.If a company has the rights to a game, they should cover all the needs of the gamer(ie patches, technical support, extras-manuals,cheats,etc), UNTIL the game is no longer owned by them.That's the way i see it

[Tom Henrik]

lallalalaallaa


Abandonware has different description all over the place, but here on this site we follow THESE rules:

1. No-one is selling the game (second-hand auctions doesn't count).
2. No-one is supporting the game.
3. No-one will get mad at us for placing the software up for download.

The last rule is constantly overlooked by a lot of members on this site <_<


LucasArts and their games Monkey Island 1 and 2 are fine examples.
1. You can't buy these games.
2. LucasArts doesn't support them.
3. LucasArts would kick our A$$ES to Timbuktu and back if we placed them up for download.

Thus, Monkey Island 1 and 2 are NOT abandonware according to this site.


Anyone complaining or trying to go by these three rules will be severly punished.

@ gregor
I am fully aware that others claim that a software is abandoned as long as no-one is supporting it. We, however, don't.

@ dr_st
I think 3D Realms, Sierra, Apogee, Soleau Software, LucasArts, Softdisk, Team 17, and ESPECIALLY ESA and a lot of other companies might like to have a word with you regarding that statement of yours.

And if by a miracle they suddenly stopped caring about warez distribution of DOS games, we wouldn't. Warez is warez no matter the OS. (And you can still BUY DOS, so DOS is NOT abandoned at all).