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[twillight]

Thx OM for all the words, but that map is not the map I want.
By the way that map is the official map included in the box of the game originally, currently it is all over the net (on pages like gamefaqs.com).
On the other hand I want the full-detailed map with all 500 cadeaux and such. Maybe - but sadly I'm not sure - this version is included in the official guide, but until I'm not sure, I won't spend money on that.

Of course I know WHAT (and not who) is a loa, and the reason of caduex I know of. Currently though I could not use them still, I only have 74 cadeaux and 9 dark souls (I finished Cathedral of Pain for the first go).

Woot, a list of secrets hacked from the gamefiles! At least that's trustable!
I hope sooner or later we find what to write over to activate all of them.
Until that, I report when I find secrets - even if just for the location.


Now back to my mapping:
So, last time I said I reached Asylum, roamed around...
So, at the point you had to choose the correct shaft to fall in (interrestingly a little before that, on the yellow corridor is a locked door what will only be openable from the other side, so keep in mind for later), you immediatelly fall into a room, where you find the engineer-key. The problem with it, that it is guarded by a new type of pigmen: it has rifle. (Actually your first encounter should be a little earlier when finding a govi, but...) The problem is of course, that picking up a new equipment takes precious time, so you can end up by pure accident pretty damaged here.

Against rifle-wielding pigmen just stand still, charge your gun, and strafe whenever they shoot a blast. Easy. The horrible thing can be when you encounter one in a compound place - there take out a secondary weapon too, and blast the hell out of 'em!

Useful to know that if you kill an enemy with anything appart your shadow-gun, they don't leave life-bulbs for you.

I figured out "holster" too. Now the alt+weapon is absolutly uncomfortable, and with pressing Enter, you holster/draw out both items in your hands, so just use the enter-version whenever you want to holster something.
Holsetring makes entering the inventory too many times, otherwise useless.
The main use of holstering is, when you have to climb onto something. To move on it (like on ropes) you need both hands, but just to hang on the object, one hand is enough. One hand is also enough the pull yourself up on the platform you're hanging on.

Now the engineer key: it is a standard key, what opens doors inside the Asylum. The "button" you have to push with this, is some kinda orange machine, does the same as the large wooden buttons outside Asylum (in Deadside).
As it is only a key, it has no use as a weapon, and using it also not cost any mana.
Ah, and you CAN equip it in Liveside! (Just for the heck of it.)

Now when posessing the engineer key, do NOT go back right to the Asylum Gateway warppoint immediatelly, but discover everything inside the Aylum's main gate (what you can, and that won't take long).
Actually you'd need to warp back to the outer walls of Asylum, as you arrive to the Front Door via a passage too high inside the wall.
It is also unnecessary to warp back, because when reaching level 3, you will feel that your shadowgun DO gain power. Finally.
Also there will be right before you a train, what will carry you into Asylum's Cathedral of Pain.

CoP is a place of gortesque. It really has a horroric atmosphere if you ask me.
But here I've encountered another glitch: when I arrived with the train, the screen went unusable, everything started to blur into each other... The solution was to save the game, then reload that save. Then everything went back to normal.
Here you should first visit the sideways for some cadeaux, a dark soul, info... Sadly when you reach the Five in Deadside, no new video is coming.

Oh, by the way you'll geta warppoint here for your teddy.

You'll also find schism-gates, what are teleporters to the Five on Liveside. Choose one, I suggest Video Nasty Killer.
Immediatelly you arrive you can go back to Nettie and Jointy for a new video!

If you insist, you're allowed to have a nice chat with VNK, but you won't be able to harm him. But you'll be able to experience his fighting-style.
First: from far he uses granade-launcher (10mm attachment to his rifle).
Second: From far and middle he uses bullets. He has an M-15 machinegun (or something similar).
Third: if you get REALLY close, he draws out a rambo-knife!

Oh, and you can find first-aid kits in Liveside as repleacement of life-bulbs. Good to know.

NOW suggest I to go back and examine those leftover doors for 4 more cadeaux (with this you'll have 78 cadeaux). Do this before going to open level 3 Shadow Doors to not forget! (remember, there are 2 lvl3SDs in the Prophecy Chamber)


Oh, I don't know wether it has any use, or it is just a hint for the player, but at the room of the Home Improvement Killer (on Deadside) there is a SWITCH. As I only entered to VNK yet (and immediatelly ported out), I know not if it has any use, but it do lights up the ~shrine of HIK. And you can see furnitures of him...


EDIT: oh, another glitch I rmemebered after reading OM's posts: At a time I was standing on a slippy pipe, and I fell from it - into lava. In the middle of the fall I hit Esc, and tried to reload. the result was, that the game (and as there is no Alt+Tab the whole computer) forze.
Therefor if you are in the same situation, just suffer the death, and reload after it.

[Ohne Mitleid]

Originally Posted by twillight

EDIT: oh, another glitch I rmemebered after reading OM's posts: At a time I was standing on a slippy pipe, and I fell from it - into lava. In the middle of the fall I hit Esc, and tried to reload. the result was, that the game (and as there is no Alt+Tab the whole computer) forze.
Therefor if you are in the same situation, just suffer the death, and reload after it.

Speaking of the Alt+Tab situation, that doesn't work for sure, but the Windows logo key will drop you back to the desktop (at least it does for me). It won't help your game saves at all, but I've used it to avoid computer freezing and then to kill the ShadowMan application from the Task Manager.

If you want to check out another "bottomless pit" glitch, there is one that I know of that seems to work without fail, but you need the Marcher Gad for it. It's in Asylum: Gateway when you drop down to the right from the entrance and follow the fire-breathing ducts over the lava pit and then around to the right. When you get to the area with the two moving platforms, you will end up on another duct above the lava after you leave the second moving platform. Walk off the bottom end of the giant 'L' shaped duct and you will fall and fall and fall. Now after what you had said Twillight, I have to go back there and check out what the sniper mode view looks like.

I still cannot find a use for the individual holster command. I know about the both hands free/both hands equipped function, but not holster by itself - either LiveSide or DeadSide. I didn't know about the roll maneuver...that would have helped me out before I finished the game, I guess. I have the controls mapped to the keyboard with keypad 5 being backwards movement and keypad 2 being crouch, so the two controls were never actually checked out in combination. Considering there was only one point in the game where I actually used crouch, I think maybe I should have figured out there was some other purpose for the action since it went almost unused.

One other thing about having your hands free besides grabbing ledges and edges. You can jump farther with your hands free. I know it sounds silly, but I think it is along similar lines to your freedom of movement when your hands are free while swimming. If you swim with an item in one hand, your direction is pulled mainly to the side of the free hand and not the equipped hand. I guess the same goes while jumping...just think of the last time you tried to run and jump with something large or heavy in one hand (or both).

Now that your Shadow Gun is gaining some power, you'll find that a full charge will tend to target things on it's own when fully charged. You still have to be somewhat facing the target, but not dead on. Try it when you encounter your next DeadWing or you are on an area/platform above an enemy and you'll see what I mean.

[twillight]

For me the windows-key do not work. But good to know it MIGHT work for others.

About onehand-holster: I use it, because I only use secondary items in case of emergency, so I want it only a key away. One free hand makes avaiable to jump platforms too, while gun can be 100% ready still. And I have a tendency pushing buttons beside each other, and as secondary weapons do NOT fire when you draw them out from holster, they don't drain my mana dry at least.

But big thx for the tip about empty hands! (Especially as one secret will require a hard jump.)

Also thx for the tip about the shadowgun's autoaim, I started to notice, and wonder what it is about.


Last tips from me for today:
Some monsters when killed do not respawn, especially event-related monsters (like the first deadwing). The tricky thing was, that currently (me being higher level) fixed monsters appeared on new positions in already explored areas. Oh well.

When found the first piece of L'Eclipser, Nettie gave another video.

About videos: despite the manual states all cutsceens will be stored inthe Video menu, this is not true. For example when you first see the Asylum from its main gate - the video has no text - is not stored.

Oh, and I didn't check this, but MAYBE the respawning of things were necessary for things like the train what brings you from A. Gateway to the Cathedral of Pain. Assume you somehow forget to collect the waypoint there, but warp out, you'd be totally stucked. But this feature was implemented in the concept, and the problem it rises was solved adequately, so I no longer mind.


Next time: The Temple of Fire! From the Youtube video that seems to be multilevel, so I already hate mapping it, although I've just reached the territory.

[twillight]

Ok, I'm stuck.
I'm in the Temple of Frie, with the same situation as the last time I was stuck: I simply can not make a jump to a platform what is at the same level as my head. It simply seems impossible.

(And I feel proud finding out myself how to find the "secret" doors in this temple. Before anyone ask, it is a must to find out that those plates on the wall must be beaken, so you can not miss this. These can be broken by shots from the shadowgun, and later the bloody curtains will need the Flamebou for the same purpose.)

A new opponent is in this temple: Sisters of Blood. They "activate" when you push buttons. They can fly. They shoot projectiles what has horizontal size too (not to big, but still mentionable). But they are slow. Unfortunatelly they usually come in pack and in compound spaces.

[twillight]

Ok, here seems to be a serious glitch. In the Temple of Fire in the room with pillars you have to climb on to push a switch, I can not climb on the first pillars.

It seems this happens with me when the platforms have a certain height (very rare fortunatelly). I tried to climb various platforms in the room, specificall the lowest ones (height is at Mike's head) and the second lowest ones (around the height of the whole screen when standing next to it).
The result was, that from a certain side I could climb one pillar (attached to the side of the room, right under a torch on the wall). From the other sides I can not do this, so I think something is glitchy here.

Now despite all this the protagonist HAVE TO climb these pillars. So I need help. If you offer your help, please send me a PM with an e-mail adress where I can send my savegame files; then you climb to the button at the top, do nothing else (no pushing the button, no opening pots - no nothing please), save the game, and finally send me back the files.

[Ohne Mitleid]

The Temple of Fire is a pretty big place. I am going to guess where you are stuck based on what I know. Sorry, I am not in the habit of sharing my email address or file sharing/swapping...nothing personal! Your install of the game might be glitchy, but I'll give it my best shot anyway.

Your previous post mentioned breaking down panels to be greeted by the Sisters. I am assuming you have not passed the first Trial of Fire, have not found the level's warp point and have never seen a swinging hammer. Do you know what a ziggeraut is? You also mentioned a room with pillars, one medium low pillar against the wall below a torch and a "button" that needed pushing. There is only one room in the area that I know fits this description. Indeed, only one room in the area with actual fire-lit torches. Does the room have fire-breathing heads and spikes popping up and down from the floor? If this is the area, great! If not, I don't believe this tip will be wasted on others.

This is a method of jumping that will save a lot of time in the future, if you are not already doing it. Approach the lowest pillar in the room which should be very near the platform against the wall with the torch above it. Continue to press forward into the pillar while jumping but do NOT let up on either control until after you have made it to the platform's surface. Now face the next pillar you can jump to, press forward and jump again but do not release the controls for either move until ShadowMan (he was upset when Jaunty called him 'Mike' in Darkside, so I won't either) grapples the edge of the next pillar. What happens is that ShadowMan actually hits the pillar with his knees followed by having his chest slam into the pillar which gives him the extra momentum to reach the edge. This method works well for almost all jumps unless the target is a short distance you do not wish to overshoot, not a long one (there is a future jump you'll need to make that you need to learn how to short jump for).

Hope it helps...if not now, it will.

[twillight]

That is the room.

I perfectly know what should I do in what order, I even allowed to choose from 3 patforms to start with - no success with any of them since hours of real time.

I mastered jumping (at least "long jumping"), and only at the start of the jump you have to push the forward-button to make the whole longdistance. The jump-button has to be pushed for the whole duration of the jump.

I even tried combining jump with rolling - no success. The only new thing was, that rolling do not makes you fit through spaces what you can not pass while standing.


I don't now if the version of the game here is glitchy (downloaded from Abanodnia), or my computer sucks, but it seem there won't be any future playing this game, as I have no other versions, and the necessary jump isn't executed, and without the Gad from this temple I can not do any progress.


In case of this is a problem, I can upload the files into a webpage. (Ok, you won't bother with this Ohne Mitleid, but maybe someone else will have the will.)

[Ohne Mitleid]

Hey Twillight, mine was glitchy too but I could still finish. What happens if someone gets you past this point and you encounter another glitch that you wonder if it is a glitch or just something else? You'll never be sure again.

I did go and grab what I think is a good copy though, even if that did have it's problems figuring out what was what too. Read post #59 in this thread if you want to know the details, it will save you a ton of time. I know the post is pretty long, but the process was very simple.

I really wouldn't give up on the game just because of a little setback. It is pretty awesome and only gets better with the more gads you collect.

If you do decide to reinstall though, save your Saves files directory and your CutScene.inf file or you will be very, very upset.

Oh, if you want to see what you might be missing, let the game run after the intro screens. Once it drops to the 'New Game' menu, you wait about 30 seconds and some level animations will begin to play. There are 9 total:

1 - Wasteland Temple of Life
2 - Temple of Prophecy (Marcher)
3 - Asylum: Cageways
4 - Temple of Blood (Nager)
5 - Deadside: Marrow Gates
6 - Temple of Fire (Toucher)
7 - Asylum: Undercity
8 - Asylum: Lavaducts
9 - Asylum: Playrooms

You don't have to wait (except for the intial startup of Acclaim etc.) too long for the next one. When you get back to the Acclaim screen, press space or escape (probably any key) which drops you to the New Game menu, wait another 30 seconds and there you have another video. They cycle through in order. I'm thinking it was some sort of demo they could keep running in the background on a screen in a store.

[twillight]

First: thx for the tip. I'll check it out as soon as possible.

Well, OM, if I want to peek in the later game, I'd just watch through the youtube walkthrough. (I checked that until the Playrooms I think, and I think there was no similar platform as what I have problem with, but of course who knows.)


Appart from this, I finished everything I could within the Temple of Fire (I had nothing else to do, so...). It wasn't THAT complicated then it looked, and the designers provided way enough life/mana to replenish after the fights with the Blood Sisters.

I reached a new Secret. Actually the legal way is using the Flambeau on a bloody carpet, but it was doable already. In the second secret door from the bottom (it has a hugh brigdge in the middle of it) I jumped on the bars of the bridge, faced directly the wall, and waited until I slide front of the opening on the wall. Then I jumped there, and violá - Flame On mode (also called Flame Grill mode on the net).

I also tried to just jump past the fire at the top of the zigguratti, but that kills instantly.

[twillight]

Originally Posted by Ohne Mitleid

I did go and grab what I think is a good copy though, even if that did have it's problems figuring out what was what too. Read post #59 in this thread if you want to know the details, it will save you a ton of time. I know the post is pretty long, but the process was very simple.

The problem with the ISO-cellar is, that downloading anything from there requires a program what requires another program, what is WinXP specific.
As I only have Win98, I'm totally screwed.