13-01-2012, 05:46 AM | #21 | |||||||
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Valleyfield, Canada
Posts: 4,892
|
I seem to have missed this thread when it got updated.
Quote:
Quote:
You are however of course right when you say your account still exist. There is assuredly at least one way to get all those downloads back... But at the cost of time and bandwidth. This specific point is still not really strong for a con, I'll give you that. Quote:
And yes I know too, I'd be surprised any average Joe would ever get caught for such a charge. But it is still illegal as far as I can see. Quote:
All those really bug me enough not to want to bother. Personal choice here I guess. Quote:
Quote:
Maybe you in particular don't mind having your personal data sent back and forth around, but I do. I would not want people to get their hand on it because, well... It's personal. Thus the name. Moreover, it is also a question of principle. I do not like the idea that a company "try to save money" on false assumptions. The best example which always flash my mind when I think about this is the music (and gaming) industries pretending they lose billions to piracy each year when in fact they actually have no tangible or even realistic data to base their numbers on. All this because they take for granted that someone who "pirate" one of their product would have purchased it anyways. Which, of course, is a false assumption. The whole thing simply don't sit well with me, at all. Quote:
|
|||||||
|
|
13-01-2012, 10:04 AM | #22 | ||
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 249
|
I have to admit that I don't even know what Steam is. I hear people talking about, but I never bothered to check. Well until today. But the page on Wiki is too long and I'm too lazy (to my defence, it's late here and I had a long day).
Can someone explain it to me in a few sentences? I got a general idea, though.
__________________
|
||
|
|
13-01-2012, 10:14 AM | #23 | ||
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 1,830
|
If you lose your digital copy you can still get the game again and easily at that, so what is your point there? At no time do you lose your game purchases unless you happen to just forget how to log in to Steam for some reason. And a cost of time is still required to get back a game if you happen to delete it from your system and reinstall it from a CD or DVD. Not to mention bandwidth if you need to download patches and the like for it.
I have just as much right to use downloaded data as I do if I brought it on CD or DVD, I can legally back it up all I want. In fact Steam gives you the option to back it up if you like. So that point is moot, I can make back ups for personal use in either case. Steam is the DRM, if you are buying games from Steam in general the DRM is going to be simply using Steam to start the game. Some games use other programs, Games for Windows Live or some other crappy program as far as I am concerned Valve should be telling them that it is not allowed. DRM pisses us all off, but as far as it goes Steam is one of the best on the markets for not punishing people for buying games, unlike some of the others. Steam is using 100mb of ram at the moment of my PC, 100 mb! Even on my old computer with 3gb of ram that was a tiny amount that I would never notice. Its CPU usage is just as small. But if that is too much for you to have a program "wasting" that is a fair point. Also your trashmen, they can get personal information from your bin. It has happened before and will happen again. Same as people stealing information from mail boxes. And that whole piracy bit has nothing to do with Steam or this thread or even to do with your personal information. Pointless drama happens when people aren't willing to be open to being wrong. If you don't like Steam that is fine, you don't play many new games and don't use the program so it doesn't matter to you. You could have simply ignored this thread and the people in it talking about why they like the program they are using. @Pex Steam is a program made by Valve, it has a store that you can buy games online. Games that use Steam as DRM get added to your library of games and are launched from the program or from there normal icons. It also acts as a multiplayer platform allowing people to use voice chat or text chat while in different games or the same. By adding your friends to it you can easily see what they are playing and even join in if it is multiplayer game. Other companies are starting to use it as a form of DRM for there store brought products, requiring that the buyer register the game on Steam, some people don't like it but it is an easier system to use then any of the other similar programs other companies are using (those being Games For Windows Live and Origin). Last edited by DarthHelmet86; 13-01-2012 at 10:18 AM. |
||
|
|
13-01-2012, 05:54 PM | #24 | |||||
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Valleyfield, Canada
Posts: 4,892
|
Quote:
But even then I would not be interested. See right below. Quote:
Steam, Games for Windows Live and other similar products are all the same as far as I am concerned. How they are handled doesn't matter in the slightest: you still need to be online for it to work. While you are online they get personal information on you and try to sell you related crap which should have been bundled with the games to begin with. It is always the same kind of marketing scheme... And as I said already here, I'm completely against such things by principle. Quote:
Now, don't get me wrong: 3% in itself is nothing. However, if you go in your task manager, you'll notice that Windows load a lot of crap by default. I did a thorough cleanup of my own system and removed or disabled all those ridiculous small but numerous background processes I don't need. For example, I never plugged nor will I ever use a printer on this PC, so the process to use and recognize printers is useless for me. Java Quick Starter... Don't need that, it will open only slightly slower without it. The Windows default help prompt, got rid of that... etc. It allows me to be able to run XP with only 512 megs of ram perfectly fine because I freed so much resources and memory from it. It however took me a fair amount of time to complete, so of course I would certainly not be inclined to accept cheerfully yet another completely useless process on my PC. Again, it is a question of principle here: if I start to say yes for one thing, then I'll eventually say yes for something else... And you end up doing it anyways. I don't want to do that. Or rather, I won't do that. Quote:
Quote:
More seriously, this is an open discussion. I voiced my opinion because TheChosen started the topic stating that Abandonia didn't seem to "like" Steam "enough" for his liking. Many voiced their opinion for Steam but also many other users also voiced their opinion against Steam in this thread... The only difference with me is that I'm ready to continue talking about it, particularly on specific points I consider important enough (as a whole, not only for this particular site) that it should be explained and discussed. To be frank, drama usually happen when a "staff member" voice his opinion (read: final say on the matter) and he doesn't want to let go because someone else simply decide his opinion differ. |
|||||
|
|
13-01-2012, 07:13 PM | #25 | ||
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Brazil
Posts: 91
|
One more thing, people shouldn't treat the personal data collection thing so lightly. Yes, they will be using it mostly for marketing and, while annoying, this particular use is mostly harmless. The problem is with the unseen usage of the information. I worked for some time in a company specialized in processing gathered personal data, for profile tracing and other things. Let me say, it is scary, to say the least.
On the 100mb thing, really, it's a lot. Granted, modern OS's have this awful trend of slugging all the resources, and lazy programmers don't help at all also, by churning everything on RAM. I have always actively opposed promiscuous memory usage, and Steam isn't helping. |
||
|
|
14-01-2012, 12:55 AM | #26 | |||
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dog City, Cayman Islands
Posts: 107
|
Quote:
Somehow I feel the same way. I also feel forced to use steam. And I hate it to be forced to do anything... My first game was a gift from a friend called: Beat Hazard. You know, it's like Audiosurf but you have a lil' spaceship and destroy enemies. A Quasi Space Invaders 2011 where you can listen to your favourite mp3s/wmas/oggs or flacs and blow shit up after a long and tiring day (even with multiplayer function now ) So I got my Steam Account. Logged in, oh Portal for free. Ok lets download it, it's for free afer all - same story like Japo's as I barely played it. The next game I wanted for many many years was Deus Ex: human revolution. And again Steam required... But surprise. You wouldn't believe it. A friend of mine works at the Media Markt here in my city and told me that several hundred ppl bought the game there on the release day just like me. So ppl are still buying games in stores. But stores are darned empty though. DX:HR was ofc an exception bc ppl wanted something to hold in their hands and say: "yessa, finally it's here and it is miiiineee!". This online-out-sourcing will cost a lot of jobs in the not the distant future I'm afraid. There aren't much ppl anymore going to the stores to actually buy a game. When I go to the Media Markt the games section is almost empty. They also have good offers there. F.e. Fallout 3 GOTY (with all 5 frackin' dlcs!) for 10 bucks or X-Superbox for 10 bucks which contains the complete X-Series (like 3,4 or even 5 games). Definitely worth it and when I have the time and mood I look by. It's not much but somehow I support ppl I know and like from my own region who work there. Who do you support you know who works for Steam? Do you even know a single person who works for Steam? No, me neither. But I know at least 5 ppl who work here for the retail industry and are paid badly bc shit like Steam. DRM is just a poor excuse imho. It just became a mechanism to tie customers with the smallest effort. And now, most of us ppl who disliked or even hated Steam are there. They did a good job. Kudos Valve to your hostile acquisition. Quote:
Quote:
p.s: forgotten one thing which is good about steam: less paper and plastic shit so it's somehow good for the environment from an ecological pov. Last edited by KrazeeXXL; 14-01-2012 at 01:14 AM. |
|||
|
|
14-01-2012, 04:26 AM | #27 | ||
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Praha, Czech Republic
Posts: 3,273
|
Cheap deals on games in my own language whilst I live abroad, it's easy to shift your account and content onto a new machine, a less painful way of managing drm than physical copies I have bought in the recent past, a totally different animal from what it was even 2 years ago. I love it.
Don't like it, don't use it. edit: For fun, compare the recent battlefield rollout debacle EA became muddled up in for a a good example of what really constitutes a bad gaming electronic delivery service these days.
__________________
I have vestigial adventure elements |
||
|
|
14-01-2012, 07:17 AM | #28 | ||||
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Lappeenranta, Finland
Posts: 2,236
|
Quote:
And even if it does finally kill retail, thats just normal human progress. Running a digital distribution business is also a job, and not some front run by a robots thats going to take all the jobs from retailers. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Last edited by TheChosen; 14-01-2012 at 10:52 AM. |
||||
|
|
14-01-2012, 08:15 AM | #29 | ||
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Praha, Czech Republic
Posts: 3,273
|
I can, I am going to argue with that.
Running your machine wastes valuable resourc... Heh, just kidding.
__________________
I have vestigial adventure elements |
||
|
|
14-01-2012, 11:49 AM | #30 | ||||
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dog City, Cayman Islands
Posts: 107
|
It isn't that easy as I'm forced to use it whether I like it or not.
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
yea 11 GB is today's games. But it's still a PITA if you want to play a new game NOW and Steam has a bad day and your dl "crawls" there between 200 and 300 kb/s... I still like the concept that I have a coupon with a number and all that. Kinda cool. But waiting many hours is bah. And what have microjunk points to do with that? Well, I talked about Dirt 3. Some Rallye racing game you get for free with some voucher when you buy a graphics card. There are various Dirt 3 Edition graphics cards out there f.e. - mine isn't but the game respectively the coupon was in there and it was kinda nice to save like 40 bucks and get a "free" game. But obviously it's a sugar-coated decoy to lure you to Steam and Windows Live as you need both accounts to get that game running. And if you want all the cars and extras you need the microsoft points and exchange them on the microjunk marketplace (some software you have to install, too). And then the Odyssey begins. I'm not a big fan of "points" at all. Whereever you get them. May it be the gas station or the drugstore. Their only purpose is to get your adress and bombard you with ads for useless junk you can get in exchange for them points. So no, I won't start with that. I have to admit I looked for a free way to get this points first but then BAM. "What the actual fuck am I'm doing here?" - ran through my head as I found myself on market research websites where they wanted my e-mail addy. Pulled the handbrake there literally. I'm still like WTF when I think back to this. xD ^^ kinda embarrassing next step on this Odyssey: to get Dirt 3 running you have to start 2 of my favourite windows services. The intelligent background transfer service and windows update. I hate both of them and they're always de-activated. I get my updates from other sources for dunno as long as I used xp. Could be 10 years or more. But ok, to play the game I activated them and got M$ infamous patch which checks if I have a legal windows copy and probably other stuff as well. Not a big problem... at all? Not if you don't care about your information. I do and what gives me the creeps & headaches is how tough corporations fight to get your information these days. Last edited by KrazeeXXL; 14-01-2012 at 12:02 PM. |
||||
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
BELGIAN APPRECIATION THREAD | dosraider | Blah, blah, blah... | 28 | 27-06-2011 07:04 PM |
SiN [STEAM] | Expack2 | Invalid Requests | 0 | 06-06-2011 11:00 PM |
The Antipodean Appreciation Thread | Lulu_Jane | Blah, blah, blah... | 11 | 31-05-2009 05:53 PM |
Classical Appreciation | SixApes | Music, Art, Movies | 18 | 03-04-2005 08:51 PM |
|
|
||
  |