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[Omuletzu]

Dos 7.10 is freeware

[Rogue]

I agree with Tom on this, except that you can't buy DOS for last 8 years. Also microsoft stoped with support of DOS, Win3.11 and Win95. Win98 is still somewhat supported, but neither of those has been sold any more in the states.

I just rescently tried to purchase Win98 or WinNT licenses, but they are not seling those anymore. Same goes for Office 2000.

I rather see less games on this site, then site closed as many others were.

[xoopx]

Originally posted by Anubis@May 5 2005, 02:05 PM
I agree with Tom on this, except that you can't buy DOS for last 8 years. Also microsoft stoped with support of DOS, Win3.11 and Win95. Win98 is still somewhat supported, but neither of those has been sold any more in the states.

I just rescently tried to purchase Win98 or WinNT licenses, but they are not seling those anymore. Same goes for Office 2000.

I rather see less games on this site, then site closed as many others were.

i think we're underneath a lot of people's radar. this is a good thing!

[gregor]

Originally posted by Tom Henrik@May 5 2005, 01:07 PM
1. No-one is selling the game (second-hand auctions doesn't count).
2. No-one is supporting the game.
3. No-one will get mad at us for placing the software up for download.

@ gregor
I am fully aware that others claim that a software is abandoned as long as no-one is supporting it. We, however, don't.

Ok first of all i would like to see those points that Smurf guy made put in the what is abandoware question made in your forums here. Instead it states some statement from wikipedia which IMO is correct, yet obviously not with policy of the site.

Secondly (and this one goes to all) i argue that not only that software withot propper support is abandonware but it might also be illegal to sell such software.
Why? because it has nothing (porpwer instuctions for nowadays users - children) that will protect consumer from making a mess out of his computer system.

why is that so? because a lot of games have it stated that they work in win 3.11 or higher. while in fact it might not work in win 2000 - that means it's all a fraud. get it?

A good example of proper old software that is still sold is Commander Keen. This game is (1) still sold and (2) they have tech support for WinXP (how to make the game work in WMDSound) and you can even write to them and they will help you.

A bad one would be from my experience Terra Nova. I saw it in the store that it is still being sold, yet there is no support for it.

Point being IF someone has rights for certain game (engine) and is selling it, than they have to provide tech support, instructions for todays computers etc. otherwise it's illegal to sell such software. As i sad before games are not artistic works (like music movies...) where one can hold it's right for 20 years (i think it's 20 or is it 25?) after which he looses them.

Also i wonder if the game is still not abandonware if an online store in Nepal (i wonder if they have Internet there?) is selling it while you can't get it in Europe?
And also is it abandonware if a programme or game is being sold by some online store and not by original company?
example ID game is sold in online store but you can't get it from ID.
Also which stores count and which ones don't? do only internet stores count? what abotu those down the street? you would all be suprised how many original package old games you can get there, eventhough they really are abandoned.

[Tom Henrik]

Nice sarcastic points.

However what I wrote above are the rules on this site.

The FAQ i meant to be general, and the general oppinion is that abandonware is not sold, not supported. However, we don't share this view.

Neither does Ken Williams, who sometimes drops by as a guest. My point is, we have a lot of attention on this site, and we are NOT going to jeopardize anything. Even if we didn't have a lot of attention, we would still feel this way about abandonware.

Being sarcastic won't get you anywhere.

[Reup]

Originally posted by Anubis@May 5 2005, 03:05 PM
I agree with Tom on this, except that you can't buy DOS for last 8 years.

You CAN still buy DOS 6.22:
two stores in the Netherlands

That's pretty cheap for an OS €31 :P



@gregor: Abandonware can be explained (rather then defined) in Wikipedia allright, but that does not make it the ultimate truth. Fact of the matter is that abandonware as such is not a legal term at all. So as far as the law is concerned, even 20 year old software that you didn't buy is considered warez! The fact that it's old, not being supported or it's rights not actively protected makes it 'abandonware'.

edit: stupid tags :whistle:

[Eagle of Fire]

why is that so? because a lot of games have it stated that they work in win 3.11 or higher. while in fact it might not work in win 2000 - that means it's all a fraud. get it?

I really fail to see any logic whatsoever in this quote. Because there is none. Why would I "get it" then?

Wikipedia is far from being an absolute resource on truth. In fact, most of the (few) times I go to Wikipedia I ask myself if half of what is written is true or pure invention.

Didn't managed to get a true oppinion on the matter yet.

[A. J. Raffles]

To be quite honest, I can't really see much of a point in this discussion. I mean, squabbling over definitions is all very well, but in the end the current policy of avoiding anything which might get a company to sue us is the most reasonable thing to do, right? Part of Abandonia's appeal (for me anyway) lies in the fact that there is a certain amount of "ethics" involved and it isn't simply about getting games for free. I think we should keep it that way, even if it means missing out on the odd game if it isn't entirely clear whether it really is "abandoned".

[gregor]

I really fail to see any logic whatsoever in this quote. Because there is none. Why would I "get it" then?

logic is teh following

1. Enscription on games box says required system to use is 386-25Mhz or higher
2. Game doesen't run on P4 3000Mhz because it's too fast for it
3. Game is not even allowed to be sold, because what says on the box is not true (it's a lie). Consumer is protected.

@ Tom i fail to see any sarcasm in my post. those questions are genuine. some games might be still sold in US by some gaming store and are now sold or supported by official maker.
I received a cataloge before last new year day where among others i could find Sim Earth (original package). and even crapier old games (all in orginal package).

[Titan]

Originally posted by A. J. Raffles@May 5 2005, 09:44 PM
Part of Abandonia's appeal (for me anyway) lies in the fact that there is a certain amount of "ethics" involved and it isn't simply about getting games for free.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Shall be be technical, eh? Becaus that seems where you guys are going.

Try this: Intelectual Property.

The creator has the EXCLUSIVE right to his/her code up to 90 years after it was created (and if things go as planed, that will be extended to 125 years in USA)

The programmer with 99% chanse signed a contract, giving up theire right to the company they worked for.

Therefor the COMPANY owns it..
They can choose to sell it, they might support it, but god damn.. they still OWN it.

If the company went down and under, it's most likly that they sold of the rights as a way to pay off debts, and someone else the the original company now owns the title/code.

They might also choose to just have it stockpiled, and perhaps use the NAME for a sequal in 70 years, but still.. they own it.

So, there is NO definition of "Abandonware".. Abandonware IS "Warez". Just as illigal.

We have our policy to have a friendly rellation with the creators, and not try to feed of them, but on the other hand, realy give the game the cretid it deserves.

Most companies we've talked to find us honest, and that we do more good then harm. Then we have Lucas Art. They are like hawks, and i FULLY understand them, and respect theire view.
Monkey Island is still a strong brand, and they choose to keep it for themselves for later use. IMHO, it's the right choise.

We are NOT about "free gamez", we'r about nostalgy. We target ppl who where in the 10-20 yr range in the late 80's early 90's.
This is where the games start REALY to drop off, and might be lost forever.

There is NO USE WHAT SO EVER to debate this issue. If it doesn't fit, there is The Underdogs at your service. They have quantity, not quality.