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Old 29-03-2005, 11:33 PM   #1
taikara
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Since everyone seems so fond of religiously-themed topics...

I'm interested in everyone's views on the topics of forgiveness and mercy, not necessarily in a religious context, but if your views are based on a particular religion, feel free to make mention of it.

Anything you might want to contribute on topic is fine, but here are a few starter questions:

When is it okay to be forgiving?

When is it okay to not forgive?

What exactly do you think forgiveness is, and how does it differ from mercy?

Have fun, don't spam, and don't forget to turn the other cheek
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Old 29-03-2005, 11:43 PM   #2
Kon-Tiki
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When is it okay to be forgiving? When somebody's done something wrong, sees what's wrong and isn't exactly proud or boasting 'bout it.

When is it okay to not forgive? When somebody's done something wrong, sees what's wrong and is proud 'bout it, or doesn't see what's wrong and is blaming somebody else, especially the person they did wrong to. Also, it's okay not to forgive if somebody's done something wrong, sees what's wrong, feels sorry 'bout it, then does it again, sees what's wrong, feels sorry 'bout it, does it again, etc. At one point, it's just one time too many, and the feeling sorry 'bout it's turned worthless.

What exactly do you think forgiveness is, and how does it differ from mercy? Forgiveness is to forget 'bout a certain thing somebody's done wrong and never coming back on it, along with seeing and treating that person the same as before. Mercy doesn't have anything to do with somebody having done something wrong. It's more a matter of compassion... putting yourself in the other person's shoes and making sure that, although the situation's suggesting otherwise, you won't harm the other person, taking his point of view into concideration as well. Dunno if this makes sense when reading, but can't put it better under words.
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Old 30-03-2005, 12:23 AM   #3
Sly
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Good post Kon-Tiki

I would say forgiveness and mercy are along the same lines. Forgiveness can be given with or without derserving punishment. Sparing someone of a punishment they deserved would be mercy. IMHO.
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Old 30-03-2005, 01:42 AM   #4
Hkizzle
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I think forgiveness depends on four things.

1) The degree of the wrong that is done. If someone kills someone else through negligence but not intension, it is still very hard to forgive. Murder > stealing, etc.

2) The importance of the person. People tend to forgive family members a lot, girls tend to forgive guys they love when they should leave the guy. We tend to forgive friends, and seem to what to punish people we do not like!

Worse thing is when important people are forgiven in the justice system. This even happens in countries with good legal systems. For example, Richard Nixon was pardoned after the Watergate incident even though the crime he commited would have landed any other person time in jail.

3) The degree of punishment could also show forgiveness. A token punishment can be forgiveness.

4) As Kon-Tiki correctly points out. The remorse or pride someone shows after an act can affect the degree of forgiveness. Even with the law not looking proud but showing remorse or submissive behaviour :crazy: can get you forgiveness. Prime example is kissing a cops behind so you don't get a ticket for speeding!

Mercy, is what Sly pointed out.
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Old 30-03-2005, 01:51 AM   #5
Evad
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Kon-tiki: very well put.

I'm raised christian(JW), but practicing Buddhist. Both these "Philosophies" preach non-judgement:
"do not judge lest thee be judged."

Now, I know that it is impossible to not judge, but the way I look at it, when I find myself Judging someone for whatever kind of ill deed they may have done to me i ask 3 questions?

1)Where are they coming from?
2)do they know how this effects me?
3)will it matter in 1 year?

I find the act of striping judgment, totally negates the sometimes impossible process of forgivness.
If I did judge that someone had hurt me intentionally, then following up with the previous templates would be sound imo
ps: i guess what I'm saying is that Forgivness, and judgement are a trap.
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Old 30-03-2005, 02:08 AM   #6
Evad
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what about you taikara?
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Old 30-03-2005, 02:42 AM   #7
taikara
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I tend to believe that forgiveness is essential when it comes to interactions with people. Nobody is perfect, everybody makes mistakes. To refuse to forgive a person for doing harm, in essence, seems hypocritical to me.

Although, I also tend to agree that there are levels of forgiveness, making some things harder to forgive than others.

Basically, I believe in forgiving, but not forgetting. If someone hurts me, I'm going to forgive them, but not forget that they did it. If they keep doing it, then I have a basis for believing the person is no good to be around, so I will remove myself from their presence.

As for mercy, I completely agree with Kon-Tiki. Mercy is a form of compassion, which does not necessarily have anything to do with a harmful action against yourself, in my opinion.

I also think forgiveness is a form of compassion, but in the sense that you would want to be forgiven in the same situation, so you should do your best to forgive.

I think compassion and empathy are two of the most important principles in human interaction. You can only understand someone if you can imagine yourself walking a mile in his shoes, imho.
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Old 30-03-2005, 02:46 AM   #8
FlightorFight
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Forgiveness is definetely a virtue. At my age, and with all the high school type situations, most of the things that people are doing won't matter in the long run. I'm pretty good about seeing the big picture, which makes it easy to forgive. I agree with Kon-Tiki, if somebody has done something bad, or wronged somebody, but they are proud of it, then it's not ok to forgive.

I do believe though, that even if someone is proud of what they have done, that you should still show mercy. Meaning, if they realize that they have wronged somebody, and they begin to feel guilty for it, you should still show them mercy and forgive them.
That's all
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Old 30-03-2005, 02:49 AM   #9
Evad
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i have a book, and am presently reading another that both say the same thing...first seek to understand. similar to how Sun Tsu said" know yourself and the other and in 100 battles you will be victorious." If you are working from your point of view alone you are limited to half the perspective.
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Old 30-03-2005, 02:52 AM   #10
taikara
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Amen. I love Sun Tzu (Art of War). Which book are you reading now? Enlighten me
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