ESA: No go! icon
 

I know it been suggested in the past, but I think it's time to bring the subject up again. When you do something for so long, you think you've seen it all... But one day or another, it get back to you.

Today someone asked on the chatbox "What does no 90! mean?".

Having no clue, I asked him where he saw that. I was expecting some random answer about something else or another site, but his next answer was:

"I want to download game X, but it's written no 90! instead of download. Where do I get the game from?"

http://www.reloaded.org/forum/style_...t/wallbash.gif

Think about all the fun you'll have to miss when the 'no go' would be linked to an explaination........
And do you really think that it would solve something? I have my doubts.
It's as dosbox, even if it's clearely printed that you better don't mount your C: directly, some still will do so .... SORRY couldn't let that one go , LMAO .

SORRY. :laugh:

This happens almost everyday.
Perhaps a more explicit message could change things...

How rude,just write No Download :wondering:

(these smilies sucks)

For the 10th time AGAIN, i agree AGAIN,:laugh::laugh:
CHANGE THAT "no 90"/"no go" :nuts::nuts: icon, for something very clear.

i agree with dosraider

totally out of context:
why is it that some games are downloadable when the page is set to english, but go all "no 90(!)" when trying to load them using the german setting?

ex:
http://abandonia.com/en/games/191/He...and+Magic.html
http://abandonia.com/de/games/13004/...and+Magic.html
(also notice the different number in the url)

Cause german is typical for restrictions... :suspicious:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doink (Post 319075) Not a Bug but a site suggestion: The "No Go"button displayed on game pages that are ESA protected should be replaced with a "No Download" button to prevent confusion and endless questions in the forum and prehaps the new button could be a link to an explanation of the ESA rules.

Think above is the best solution

Think that the questions will be:
Why is there a 'no download' for this game.
:laugh:

In fact, I'm pretty sure of it.



.... No, I'm sure of that.

Or even better put the download button back and when it is clicked on an explanation similar to what david86 suggested should be displayed... Only bigger M U C H B I G G E R

Been there, done that, didn't help one jot. Some idiots actually started referring to it as "the ESA error".

Ok, seriously, what about this simple message?
"Not Available at the moment"

OMG, I love this kind of topics, really.

Done that on another AW site.
Following post is real:
plenty of :When will it be available again?????? I want that game, I'm desperate !!!!!!!.

No joking. ALAS.

Whatever message or explaination they get, they GONNA post.

Do you have any proposal then?
I mean, did you solve the problem in your AW site or not? :oh:

I don't mind those kind of people who are desperate and absolutely want a game . I've seen it too, plenty of times. Those are passionates who usually are only looking for one game in particular are in no way related to the current problem.

Did you try to find the related ESA article in the FAQ? Unless it been changed recently, it's well hidden (unfortunately alike many other functions on this forum :notrust:) and doesn't explain too well what the deal is all about.

Frankly, what can you answer back when someone ask you "What is No 90!?" when the icon do look like it's written exactly that? Can you really blame people from asking those questions when they expect to have a download link which will change their cursor when they hover the mouse above it? For all what we know, they might just think it's some kind of ad and they don't even bother to look at it...

If we had a good page explaining the situation, we could answer back "read the faq" and we would not waste too much time. Right now, however, it is not the case and it's obvious that there is a problem and that it is growing. The main difference in volume, I think, is that the chatbox is now used by those who would not bother otherwise to make a post about their problem.

Also, I would not expect an answer from Dosraider if I were you David. From experience of another thread, he's not really into open discussions... He thinks he's right and he'll stick to his opinion no matter what. Pretty much like me. :amused:

It wasn't 'my' AW site, I simply was active there, first as mod and later as admin, and it's defunct :(

Proposals? Enough, you can of course try all that's been said here, it will all have the same result: none.

They will post the same questions, over and over again.
You can link explainations, post stickies, special icons, won't help.
Even not allowing 'guest' posters won't help.

Aslong as there are sheets with reviews about games that can't be downed, they will ask. And retrieve those ones and they still will post such questions.
Nothing will change that.

Look at the bright side of it, always good for a laugh.
:laugh:

It's the same as with dosbox, howtos allover the net, stickied or not, it doesn't help, they ask the same things over and over.

[Edit]
Did YOU ever asked what the 'no 90' means EOF? Don't think so.
See, idiots will be idiots, whatever you put up there.

And I'm always in for changing my opinion about something.
But now I'm right :amused:

To this kind of problems there can be only a solution...

1) take the guy apart
2) format C: on his brain
3) reinstall a better brain (no windows based please... obviously:nuts:)

Other then that nothing can be done :(

This because internet is filled with all kinds of guys (nerds, newbies and so on) ... and most of them are always in sycopantic research of the easy way/solution... they will never alt to read or think and they will always ask for this "easy way" and never try nor think to try to solve the problem in other ways :mad:

Thing is DosRaider, you're right... If the subject of this thread is "what can we do to prevent newbies from asking why they can't download ESA protected games ever"...

Which unfortunatly is not the case. ;)

Edit: it is a little slower now at job, so I have time to think about this more.

IMHO, the best suggestion so far been given by Doink. If you guys are looking for suggestion, I'd suggest myself that a new page would be created on the site only to answer this very specific question and all other related questions. However, it should be made so that the question "why can't I download ESA protected games" is up top and very visible. It's the question most users want to see answered and they don't often care for anything else, or a long explanation either for that mater. Followed closely by something like "Then why do you still have the review of that game up if you have no intention of allowing me to download it?". Then the page would continue with all the other related questions, and I guess it would be easy to link that page to the already existing FAQ we have on site.

The most important change however would need to be the ESA icon itself. It need to be changed to something more visible if possible, but I'd suggest making it pretty alike the current download button but with a big red X or something like that barring the image and a small space saying something like "if you want to know why you can't download this game, click here.".

The whole idea is, of course, to give a chance for people who do want to know and do read first to get to the new page I was talking about, hopefully giving them the insight they need and are looking for. This site always been about quality over quantity, and I think this suggestion go in that direction.

Well, we can go the evil way and give them empty .rar to download...


Maybe it is possible to note somethng like that:
Protected by ESA foundation/corporation/blah!

the point is that there is no relation between
no 90! and ESA

But if you write no download or not downloadable or anything more clear people can just relate that with the ESA icon, and that this means something else and it is protected, or just illegal to download for free.
People will make the realtion between protected and not downloadable...i hope so...:oh:

This could only make things worse.

You all have said intelligent things, but I'm still convinced that the "No 90" icon could be replaced by one more understandable.
In this way we won't stop them, but it's likely that we'll reduce the number.

"NOT AVAILABLE", "NOT DOWNLOADABLE", "NO DOWNLOAD", "NOT ABANDONWARE"

How about writing something like:
"download will be available after 01.03.2011"
Since we know how ESA works, we know when games will be available - it could be simple to tell the less smart of people when it will be downloadable, and below that a link to explanation about what is ESA and why do we have to wait so long.

I agree with you, it is the best solution until now.

Even if they understand in one glance the 'no go' they WILL post.
Once again I rest my case.
They WILL post.
No escape.
Never.
Whatever you do, whatever explaination you link, they WILL post.

Et voilà!

It won't solve the problem at 100% but now we have a reason to ban them :noworry:

Like - you are stupid. Thus we will ban you! :weird: :confused: :amused:

Well...at least they will ask us "why??", not what "ESA no 90" means...it's easier to explain :laugh:

Your icon looks better, David. :)

Fully seconded.
Neat.

so no more making fun of the newbs who don't get what does 'no go' mean? :(

Sorry russ :laugh:
You're right dosraider, we won't solve the problem, but the "no 90" icon was a clear source of misunderstandings, don't you think?

is the esa part actually needed ?
I mean any game that isn't sold isn't downloadable either.

Replacing it isn't very hard, but I think Maikel and Kosta need to be consulted

Good work David!

Great icon David!!

to the admins (crowds hurling):
-change it! change it! change it!!!:laugh::laugh:

Thanks guys :)

ESA part is only for protected games, so...this is my new experiment for Sold games :idea:

Edit: Data are you talking about a simple "Not Downloadable" icon? I can do it in a minute.

the green on white is somehowwerr=S

Here you are :)
If you want it bigger don't worry to ask.

or this? *runs from david*
http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/9489/ndzm7.gif

edit: actually since the whole site has new design, maybe no go icons could suit the design as well

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/2990/ndsr0.gif

Ahem, don't worry :amused:

Nerd guy one is original, but maybe a bit sterile like the whole site design, more colours won't hurt I think.

then shouldn't be there "more colorful" download buttons as well? :p
it's like putting a cotton candy stand in the middle of the insurance company main hall

is there any way to remove all the ESA protected games? it gets in the way alot, and gets me ticked off when i really want to play a game, and i can't...

Removing protected games is not going to happen for two reasons (at least). First, any game currently protected may be unprotected (abandoned) later and for that reason we'll keep the games and reviews. Secondly, Abandonia is more than about free games, it is also a museum where you can drop by and see what games used to be like. It's easy to forget that the free games here could be considered more of a bonus than the actual and only purpose of Abandonia.

As said before -(in other topics)-, the site isn't only about downloading games.
And those games can become downloadable in time. Some have put effort in writing reviews, taking screenshots ... whatever.
And it is not because a game isn't downloadable that it can't have a discussion topic on the forum. Plenty peeps like to discuss games here, downloadable or not.

Of course if you consider Abandonia and similar sites as suited only to grab free stuff, I understand that you get 'ticked off'....

IIRC, there should be a way to filter them out from your searches.

Having a look at the FAQ, I noticed the list of the different status icons are nowhere to be found, only their explaination. I'm currently using IE and don't know if using Firefox will help. Anyway, with the explaination and no icon to go with that explaination, telling people to read the FAQ won't do as much good as if the icons were included in the FAQ.

Looks understandable enough to me.

[Edit]
Except that the link for this is borked.

Yes it does.
But mind the standard USERS! :confused:

Serious, there will always be people that ask what to do next if there is a --->CLICK HERE<--link on the page. :amused:
;)

Perhaps it does because you have seen the icons already so even if they're not there, you have no trouble "matching the right icon to the right line of text". Thing is, above it is promised you will find a list of all the icons, but you won't. Perhaps others who are unfamiliar with these icons are looking for something icon-looking. We still get questions about that NO 90, but if that piece of text was acompanied by the NO GO icon, then perhaps their light bulb would light up before asking "what's wrong with the number 90?".

I'm very tempted to make more jokes on the newbies, but enough. :amused:

Yes, that might bring the problem a bit closer to solution. But some people will still ask before thinking or reading. This we cannot avoid. :notrust:

On the other hand, the % of those kind of "no go" / "ESA"questions are probably very low compared to the amount of visitors here, even the new ones.
Peeps that are visiting the site/forum daily -(or even more often)- will of course be amazed that almost daily there is such post, but in fact it only occurs sporadically.
It's also comprehensible that these ever returning questions in the same topic is because noone reads a 10 pages topic (ref : princess maker2)
......... sigh........

I did't realise it before but if you hover your curser over the No Go icon a text box pops up saying "download" this could be causing the confusion

I have an interesting question. If a game is ESA protected shouldn't the manuals to the game go under the same jurisdiction? I'm just curious.

Nope, they have legitimate uses (serving as replacement of genuine owners of the original game who misplaced theirs).
If a company specifically wanted manuals for one of their games to be removed and contacted us to do so, we would.

Returning on topic:
@Data about new icons: I don't see Maikel on site since years and I don't think he will answer to me.
So, I wonder whether someone will change "NO 90" icon with a new one (mine or russ, it doesn't matter) or not.

My own brother asked me today out of context what was the deal with the "no 90" button on the site. He understood perfectly that he could not download the games with those button (he's an intelligent chap, just like me ;)) but like all the others he never even thought about the button saying "no go" instead of "no 90". I was quite annoyed by the fact my own brother fell into the 90 trap and talked with him for a while on the matter...

I think that those who do not have a good enough graps of the english language, such as my brother, have no idea that "no go" would actually be proper english. They then assume the button to mean "no 90" since go and 90 are so similar with that font...

Could you ask your bro why he didn't read the "get it" icon as '9et it' icon?
It's the same letter font they used, but none ever asks what the '9et' stands for, seems as when they can download there isn't a problem to understand it.

No pun intended, just a thought.........

Probably much for the same reason he read GO as 90. If you haven't heard the expression no go before, no 90 makes as much sense. I haven't, and I doubt many have, heard 9et before, so "get" makes more sense without me having to think about it.

Ask a silly question...
 

Probably descended from the people who used to ask, "Who is General Failure Error, and why is he reading my hard disk?"

Sorry, used to be my favourite joke :p

But yes, if people read the forums before they asked about ESA, they wouldn't keep posting silly questions and getting shouted at by the Fifth Horseman... :laugh: Poor Horseman, driven mad by nitwits. :amused:

actually, if the "no go" icon linked to a short article explaining that some company still holds the copyrights (global article, not separate per game), then we probably wouldn't have any

but i'm against it, i like seeng fun with newbies :P

Heeheehee. I like this forum. :nuts: I shouldn't have lurked for so long, unregistered...

You also like naked gardening, but...yes that's another story :D

Okay, I'll watch that. Long as he doesn't bend over or anything. :weird:

We (ie Horseman) should really remove the "Download" part of the title bar of ESA-protected games. Or say, "Download X - not for download". Which is an idiocy worthy of Microsoft, I must say.

And if they click on the ESA logo, have a disclaimer. (With a link to the ESA nuking comic). And a big sign at the end of said disclaimer saying YOU CAN'T DOWNLOAD IT HERE. TRY GOOGLE. GOOGLE IS YOUR FRIEND. :laugh:

Big sign should be on top - none reads to the bottom ... or do you ??

Hi, just want to add my comment.

I also read this as no 90.

I have been playing around with computers since 81 and seen more fonts than I care to remember.

Why did I not realize it was no go?

Because this was my first visit to this site and the first game I looked at so I had no previous experience where the download button should be. The icon does not look like a regular download button, more like som age recommendation mark.

I read no, not as no in not, but no in number: Number 90.

I figured this as some kind of categorization.

I even looked in the forum but did not find any heading that looked related so I asked google and found this thread.

I have puzzled together what it means but I have still not found a link to this esa or any page clearly explaining that this means.

My tip is to clarify the icon to read No download, ESA protected game.

Then make it a link to a page that clearly explains what ESA is and why you don't offer download.

Basic usability will not solve all cases but some.

For the rest of us first time visitors it would save a lot of time and irritation. Instead of spending 5 minutes trying to find out why I don't have a download button I could go look for another game that does.

I would probably not have stayed on the site had I not looked up another game and found a download button.

Read the goddamn FAQ! <- Even the (mean) forum knows the link.

*Looking into my HD
I have those new icons I made somewhere...

I've just checked... The old "NO 90" icon is still there...

Any update? This need to be fixed ASAP...

A new icon can be whipped up in 5 minutes. Replacing the current one is the problem.

i still like having fun with newbies:P

I don't have fun with newbies flooding Troubleshooting because of it...

*sigh*

you all wrote a lot, i was patient, read and listened, waited and keept reading. but in the end, i have still no clue about this "no go". is it because:

1. the game isnt available at all
2. the server capacity is reached and will the game can be downloaded somewhat later
3. i overexceeded my total download volume...?!

It says in the FAQ what it means. It means the game is protected. However, this does not mean the game is protected indefinitely, only that it's protected for the time being and might be available once again in the future.

BTW: I wouldn't worry too much about any d/l limit :) I never heard of such a thing around Abandonia.

You didn't read Faq: :mhh:

http://www.abandonia.com/en/faq

Another point that a lot of people ask themselves is, why did we bother to add those entries in Abandonia if we can't download them?

The answer is simple: unless I am mistaken, no entries were ever made when the game wasn't available for download. All the NO GO games were freely distributed at one point in time on this site. We then keep the review up for informational purpose and to preserve the work done by the contributers.

Wouldn't it be possible to make the NO GO! icon which, when clicked, would upon up a new window/tab right at the FAQs? Hopefully these noobz will stop posting crap like this on the forum then! :rant:

We used to have something like that... on the old site.

why not just put a brief list of rules at the top of each forum directory or when they go to post a message put the rules to the left or right of the posting box?

The newb question before: "wtf is dos box and does it run on win xp?"

The newb question now: "omg wtf is this no 90 icon i cant download this game help me"

Anyway... I have an idea. Why not kinda make an auto PM (pop up upon forum access) to all new users that reads "Before you post any problems with DOSBox or the site in particular (like not being able to download game X) read the FAQ"

The forum header says exactly that if you visit the forum and don't have an account yet or haven't logged in yet respectively.