the elder scrolls: arena

[Stroggy]

not exactly a discussion
but good news to all rpg-players
today is The Elder Scrolls's 10th an anniversary!
so they are giving the original TES game "arena" out for download.. free of charge!
http://www.elderscrolls.com/index.php

[Omuletzu]

I never liked Elder scrolls, although RPG is my favorite game gendre.IMO Diablo II, NWN and NOX are much better.Also an excellent RPG is Sacred(newly released).

[Stroggy]

I prefer Morrowind over NWN
NWN was jsut too linear for me
usually if you make a game linear I expect a good story (like in the case of Knights of the old republic) however NWN was linear AND had a rather weak story.

[mika]

Anyone ever played Revenant? Now that was a great game - kind of like Diablo but a bit more interesting in my eyes.

[Danny252]

Played the demo of it. If I remember correctly the graphics didn't work on my system properly. Although had i got it working Im sure I'd have loved it(stupid PC.. hey.. whats happening.. my hard drive.. sorry! sorry! nice PC! good PC.. ahh..)

[Stroggy]

well its a bit difficult tog et it running correctly
dosbox will work (with rather bad music) but it will be very slow
after pressing ctrl-f12 a few times it will speed up to a normal speed but the sound will be ruined
VDMsound works perfectly... however the mouse does not.

[LotharGR]

I have played only "morrorwind" from the series of elder scrolls, and although it has a gigantic world, i do not like it at all as a game. Firstly, where are shields? Shields haven't been invented in this world? And secondly i do not like its people... I got sick even looking at their faces, they are very annoying :P They are the most bad-looking characters i have ever seen on a RPG. Really ugly.... Anyway... that's just my opinion, someone else ( and i know that there are many ) do like this game a lot :)

[mika]

I got sick even looking at their faces, they are very annoying :P They are the most bad-looking characters i have ever seen on a RPG. Really ugly

Funny enough I agree with you. I installed it, saw what the characters looked like, and uninstalled it. Pretty wierd hey? :?

[LotharGR]

I suppose that when their models where designed the idea was to look like they are hostile to you... but this gets annoying after looking many of them, and also they do not chance even when they get friendly to you... They still seem hostile ( and in a sinister way also )

[Stroggy]

right
thats what msot of the fans were thinking
but thanks to the new mods the chance you will ever see a player screenshot of Morrowind with one of the old faces in it is reduced to zero.
same goes for the bodies

there are shields in Morrowind, each armour has its own shield... not to mention to special shields... in fact one of the biggest secret treasures is a shield.

the same person that made some of the models used in Unreal Tournament 2003 and 2004 created some of the first user-made faces jsut so you know, take a look at the new faces:
http://home.wnm.net/~bgriff/MW_FM01_Ed01b.JPG http://home.wnm.net/~bgriff/MW_FM02_screen4.jpg http://home.wnm.net/~bgriff/MW_NordF02s.JPG

pretty good eh?
well now there are quite a few mods which use better face models and textures.

anyway, we are straying off topic, this is about arena!
I haven't played any of the other TES games myself (its sequel Daggerfall is supposed to have one of the most complex stories ever... or so i heard)
the first time I even heard about TES was when i played the demo of Redguard... which wasn't even a real TES game (it was a TES:adventures game)
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[LotharGR]

If i remember correctly redguard was one of the last games that could be run under DOS... Sadly i never played it. ( i like every game that involve pirates, i love that age :) )

[Stroggy]

as far as I understand Redguard didn't exactly involve pirates.
but there were boats in it!
as far as i know Redguard was about the Redguard uprising in the second Era in 864(Redguard are darkskinned humans in The Elder Scrolls) against the rule of the Empire and the corrupt governor Richton.
your character is the redguard Warhero Cyrus who searches for his lost sister.
He finds out his sister was in league with the rebels against the Empire.
The game ends up with you leading the first rebellion at the port city of Stros M'kai which eventually turns into the rebellion of the entire Redguard populace in the province of Hammerfell.

so not exactly pirates... but it could be that you are right
as I have said i never played the full game.

[LotharGR]

I have seen only pictures of the game... Simply the characters reminded me of pirates ( i think i saw and a cutlass in one of the pics i saw - a classic pirate sword :P ).

[Stroggy]

true
the game does have a pirate feeling to it
and the boxart does indeed show a cutlass... and the fights are kinda like in pirate games (duels)

[LotharGR]

Thats why i liked it and wanted to play it.... but sadly i never had :( anyway... :)

[Stroggy]

I don't think you missed much
from what I saw the dialogues went on and on and on (seriously)

[The Niles]

The only TES game I played was Morrowind and since that was supposedly the best game in the series and I did not like that game very much I will not be trying any other. At leats not until a sequal of Morrwind commes out.

[Stroggy]

Morrowind wasn't the best in the series
according to the fans Daggerfall was the best in the series
but seriously youc an't extrapolate your experience with morrowind over to all the games
we're talking about Arena (1994) while Morrowind was released in... 2002 or something?

anyway the game is amazing
a huge world
changing seasons
day and night
rain, snow, mist

[The Niles]

I agree with everything you said about morrowind. But these were not things that I disliked about it. The combat was bad. I tried using the bow and it was completely useless. The mage gains experience far to slowly to be effective unless you take two hours of real time and start practicing. The story is all but non extistent. The world is so huge you can walk for hours on end and not be in the same place twice but the reason you would want to often escapese me. You can wonder into area's you are not supposed to be at your skill level and get cut to ribbons. You unlock quests that you cannot complete because you don't have theskills for it and once you do you have forgotten what it was you needed to do and are forced to go through pages and pages of notes in your journal that are not catagorized. Your armour and weapons degrade over time so you are forced to repair them or replace them. Realistic enough maybe but it'sa game! Where is the fun in that?
I liked Morrowind for a while but after my jaw had once again connected to the rest of my face I got frustrated and left the game. Once I have my new computer I would not be surprised if I started it up again to see what DX9 looks like but not before.

[Stroggy]

I have never played an archer or mage character so I can't comment on that

the story is VERY big and VERY deep... the only problem is that you need to read the books the people shove into your hands.
the entire story of morrowind is actually brilliant since you are supposedly the reborns prophet and you need to help the 'good' guys defeat an age old 'badguy'
now when you read into the story you learn that there is some evidence the 'good' guys actually killed you in your past life and the 'bad' guy made an outh to your past self to protect an artefact, he wouldn't give it up to the so called good guys that killed you so they started a war against him using you (the reborn prophet) as a tool.
well thats the story in a nutshell... its quite confusing at times.

there are numerous ways to get around quickly (silt strider, boat, magic)
to key locations (less important lcoations are usually close to key locations)

it is true you can wonder into lcoations beyond your level, thats why it is advised to join a faction, they give you equiptment and quests that are fit for your level (and they also provide training in case you are not ready)

Many people complained about the journal system so it got a big overhaul in the expansion Tribunal.
in the case of weapons, fi you carry a hammer around with you theya re easily repaired.

now seriously, I am not talking about morrowind, i'm talking about arena
one is from 1994, the other one from 2002,... reallyg vie it a try
I've been playing it and (besides some tedious dungeons) its immense fun!

[LotharGR]

A last comment on Morrorwind... I suppose that this game you can either love it or hate it :)

[Danny252]

I cant get out of the dungeons.. alive...

[Stroggy]

A last comment on Morrorwind... I suppose that this game you can either love it or hate it :)
indeed it is
I'm still in love with it
the mods are just excellent

but for all those who think morrowind has no story, I refer you to this page http://til.gamingsource.co.uk/mwbooks/
it contains all the books that appear in morrowind (some of them are just random stories... usually with a very dark ending) but there are a lot of them that talk about the political situation, religion, the conflict between the houses, some very cryptic religious texts (like sermon zero)
research texts about the Dwemer (the dwarven-like people that mysteriously dissappeared suddenly) and so on and so forth

[Omuletzu]

You can say whatever you want, but Diablo II will always be better :P
BTW stroggy have you ever played diablo II?

[Stroggy]

I only played the first Diablo and LOVED it
Its funny since Diablo is mainly a dungeon-game while nowadays I dislike dungeon-games.
Diablo was one of the first games I ever played... too bad I borrowed it from somebody and had to give it back.
I've never played Diablo II

[LotharGR]

although i believe that Diablo is a great game ( both Diablo 1 and 2 ) i don't know if i would put them in the RPG category... in Pure RPG's there is at least a bit of interactivity with other people, you talk with others etc. Diablo is simple Hack-n'-Slash :) Not that this is a bad thing... after all, Hack n'Slash is the only element of RPG games that ComputerRPGs do better than Pen & paper RPGs. They are not as deep as real RPGs ( up until now at least - i can't know what will come next )

[Stroggy]

although i believe that Diablo is a great game ( both Diablo 1 and 2 ) i don't know if i would put them in the RPG category... in Pure RPG's there is at least a bit of interactivity with other people, you talk with others etc. Diablo is simple Hack-n'-Slash :) Not that this is a bad thing... after all, Hack n'Slash is the only element of RPG games that ComputerRPGs do better than Pen & paper RPGs. They are not as deep as real RPGs ( up until now at least - i can't know what will come next )

i know the first diablo has some communication with the inhabitants of the village... I don't recall how much but there was some

[LotharGR]

Well it wasnt communication really.... the villagers just "talked" to you, you could not reply to them. You always made the "quest-related" questions to them, with the main purpose to find another quest because the goal of the game was to find all the quests... anyway, this isn't the only example that shows that Diablo isn't a pure RPG - it doesn't have character creation ( although of course it has character advancement ). As i said above i dont believe that this things are bad elements of the game. Because of the nature of this game it should be fast paced and have simple playability. This is what makes Diablo great. It has that unique characteristic that made games historical since "Pac-man" :) Simple-but-fun-to-play.

[Omuletzu]

I've never played Diablo II
Man, you'r missing all the fun.IMO diablo II is (far) more better than it's predecessor, in every aspect.Related to the "no interaction" feat, i think it's one of the features that made this game sooooooooo good.I mean you talk a little, and then you hack&slash your way through those monsters.

[Stroggy]

Diablo 2 is somewhere on my list of games that I'll play some day
along with Bladur's Gate I and II
perhaps Icewind dale I and II aswell

[LotharGR]

Diablo is the best game to relax :) after a bad day at work etc you chop to pieces a few monsters ( instead of your boss :P )

[Jwh D'Ar]

When talking about RPGs no game can beat the Baldurs Gate series. It's simply the best RPG ever.

Planescape: Torment is the runner up.

Diablo 1&2 is also great, more hack'n'slash.

IWD 1&2 is good, a bit too linear.

The Elder Scrolls series really becomes boring after 1 hour of play because you realize the huge world is not huge but a series of 5 repeating quests and locations. And the fight is very bad.

[Decalies]

For me, Planescape: Torment and the fallout series are the best cRPG, directly followed by Baldur's Gate 1+2.

[Maikel]

I loved morrowind. It's a singleplayer mmorpg :D . It had it's flaws but I like the overall design of the landscapes and the city of vivec. Though vivec was pretty ..empty for a capital city. I installed a mod which added like 100 extra npc's around so it looked more alive. Worked for me.

I also loved the various armors around...let me see If I can find a pic of my outfit :D

[Havell]

Yeah, Morrowind rules. I love the way you can work your way to the very top of any of the game's guilds, complete the story, or just explore the world in your own time.

[FreeFreddy]

In that case Gothic 1 and 2 is better than Morrowind, it's world is little smaller, but never repeating like Morrowind and it is somewhat more attractive game.

[Stroggy]

hah, its not at all more attractive.

anyway with the new sailingmod for morrowind youc an see just how diverse morrowind is.

[FreeFreddy]

Well, I got both Gothics and Morrowind at the same time, but I just threw a glance at Gothic 1 to see how it is, and then I decided to play Morrowind through. I played it for approx. 2 hours, then I unistalled it from my pc and decided to give Gothic a chance instead. I did never regret it and I did never want to play Morrowind again.
Well, I know that different people always like different kinds of games, but if you didn't play Gothic 1 and 2 yet, try it out, I'm sure you would understand the difference between it and Morrowind.

[Stroggy]

I have played Gothic I and II
In terms of graphics gothic is not nearly as good as morrowind
and in terms of storyline, while both aren't all that great, Morrowind is better (mostly because the story isn't straighforward and often the badguy is the badguy because he is MORE evil, and even that is open to speculation)
However Gothic is better in terms of realism, almost every character in the game is unique and had his/her schedual, while morrowind (without the mods) is quite static.

However morrowind does have the editor, which (while not a part of the game) cannot be disregarded.
Thanks to the editor we now have mods that add anything from smoother, realistic, bodies and heads, to new textures and cities and entire new continents.
And even entire new continents: http://wizards-islands.com/ is a mod soon to be released which adds a whole new continent with new spells, armors, buildings, monsters etc...
and then there is Tamriel Rebuilt, the goal of the team is to create the entire area of Arena again, but this time in detail (not generated areas)
http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/
So far onloy the entire province of Morrowind (that is mainland Morrowind)
and a part of Skyrim is complete, but the level of detail in the areas is amazing.


Anyway, since you claim you only played it for 2 hours youa ren't really in a position to judge it...

[NeVeR]

Maybe I missed it, but how come noone mentioned Daggerfall?
IMHO, that's a great game...Though I only saw few pictures of Arena, Daggerfall seems MUCH better. After all, it IS like Arena 2, right? :)

[Stroggy]

Daggerfall is Arena 2 (actually arena is TES1 and Daggerfall is TES2)
anyway, the reason I ahven't mentioned daggerfall is because i never played it.
I only played Arena because it was put up for download free at the main site.
Daggerall is, supposedly, the best TES game.
It is still a generated world, however the important cities all have a different feel to them (unique buildings)
also from now on guilds were included (thieves guild, mages guild) where you could take quests from.
i once read the entire story of daggerfall and was downright confused, the ammount of plottwists were nearly too hard to comprehend.
Not to mention the insane political ties between royal families, and the fights inside each royal family.

You could say Daggerfall was the original TES sicne it created the entire history of the world (mainly because it contained books and much, much more dialogue)

[FreeFreddy]

Daggerfall was only released in USA, never in Europe, therefore it is almost unknown in Europe.
@Stroggy - yes, you may be right, 2 hours are almost nothing, but that was enough for me. After 2 hours of playing Gothic though I didn't stop playing it, I continued until it was time to go to bed....
Gothic is just much more user-friendly than Morrowind and still manages to be very interesting, but, as I said, everybody prefers his own kinds of games, and I prefer Gothic 1 and 2 all over Morrowind, not only, but at large part because of the conversations there which are so natural and often funny, I've never seen conversations been natural and convincingly like that in any other games.

[Stroggy]

did you play gothic in german?
I played it in English... sometimes I couldn't stop laughing at the mistakes made, kinda ruined the atmosphere for me.

anyway I really do suggest you give morrowind another try, with the mods perhaps.
Its really a game to get hooked on.

[FreeFreddy]

Hmm, well, then I guess I'll get 2 months free time and try Morrowind again (little scared of the size of the game-world there... 8) ).
Yes, I played both Gothics in German, and I heard too that English version's dialogues were not that good translated.
I just wished you would be able to play German Gothic through and understand all the dialogues there, I'm sure you would then get completely new insight to the game because of them.

[NeVeR]

anyway, the reason I ahven't mentioned daggerfall is because i never played it.

:shock: :shock:
*Slaps him* :D

You should try it if you like Arena or Morrowind :wink:

[Stroggy]

A friend of mine is going to give me his german version of gothic 1 in august, I'll judge then.

And as for daggerfall: I've tried and tried to get a hold of a version but so far all effort were unssucesfull :cry:

[Christian IV]

:blink: :wacko: :blink:

Yes i thought the bow was useless, and it does take soooooo
long :whistle: to get experience at times .....and you get killed
without knowing why, I wanted to like morrowind because I liked
arena, back when i first played them, i just downloaded arena again
thanks to the 10th anniversary issue, that was nice :D

now i will have to see if i can find get a copy of morrowind after that
:ok: