PDA

View Full Version : Diablo Ii


Blood-Pigggy
28-08-2006, 01:28 AM
<div align="center">Diablo II (Lord Of Destruction)[/b][/quote]

Diablo 2 brings incredibly addictive gameplay, and some surprisingly deep character development together.


Somewhere in the RPG genre, there is a line. This line seperates the complex and story oriented RPGs from the action based gameplay oriented RPGs. While gaming snobs constantly attempt to discredit the latter, their attempts fall flat, as while the deep and complex RPGs usually deliver quite well, it never stacks up to the pure addictive qualities of the other side of the line, the action oriented RPG.

Diablo 2 picks up after the original Diablo. The warrior who defeated Diablo prior to this installment has found the bright idea of jamming the "soulstone" which holds the essence of the invading demon Diablo. His belief that he can contain this monster within himself is dashed as he finds that he will not be able to contain the demon for much longer. Now he travels east to find his demonic brothers, Mephisto, and Baal, so that he may continue his war to take over the human realm. You must battle through his minions, and find him in his lair in hell, and put an end to the demonic invasion.

It's a cookie cutter story, but the history surround the world and backstory is fascinating, and the dialouge cinematics are very well done, and the writing is exceptional.

While many people argue that Diablo 2 and its expansion aren't RPGs, and just "action games with experience points tacked on" they're sorely mistaken, as despite the clickfest nature that Diablo 2 carries, the game has a surprisingly deep, and quite complex and powerful leveling system.
Even though Diablo 2 has been out for six years, and the expansion around four, there are still new types of characters being developed each day on BattleNet (Blizzard's multiplayer component for most of their games) which shows Diablo 2's pure potential to express creativity in however you wish to develop your character.
As in any RPG Diablo 2 has an wealth of quests. Unlike the original Diablo, they aren't randomized anymore, but instead, Blizzard opted to go for far more interesting and rewarding quests than those of the original. Most quests push the storyline further, but there are a few optional quests which are worth doing purely for the great bonuses they offer.

Diablo 2 plays quite simply, which allows nearly anyone to jump right into the game without a problem. While developing your skills properly might take some time taking used to, navigating the world and laying waste to your enemies will be as simple as ever, putting aside the annoying dice rolls and mysterious random resistance rolls.
D2 instead opts to use a simple armor and attack rating system, which without throwing in anymore annoying and confusing numbers, simply dictates how hard it is for an enemy to hit you, or the chance you'll hit an enemy respectively.

Allowing you to focus more on the game itself, and less on random numbers and meaningless statistics, Diablo 2 plays by nearly only two buttons, the left mouse button, and the right mouse button. You can assign which ever skills you've chosed to either button, and you can hotkey each skill for easy access. You can switch your skills on the fly (operating as spells or combat skills, and passive skills that work on their own, adding benefits to your character constantly). While you battle, the game is mostly handled by clicking on your enemies with either button to deliver your attack of choice.

Battles become far more interesting as resistences and weakness come into play, so that the game doesn't degenrate into a completely mindless waste. Certain monsters are weak to fire or ice, or etc. proper detection of such weakness will make the game easier for most players, and proves to spice up the gaming experience quite a bit.
Diablo 2 handles leveling up quite easily. A bar at the bottom of the interface shows your progress to the next level as you kill enemies. Once you do level, you get the chance to distribute five stat points and one single skill point.

While this review contains both Diablo 2 and it's expansion Lord of Destruction, one should note the differences. Lord of Destruction adds two new character classes, one new Act (instead of the original's four) brand new class specific items, runes, and jewels. There are several tweaks to existing characters, and the overall experience is more balanced this time around.

Diablo 2 gives you a fine repetoire of attributes to improve, and properly developing your character in both attributes and skills will prove important to how your character plays.
The attributes follow as such.

http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/674/screenshot003ah6.th.jpg (http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot003ah6.jpg)
While it looks quite simple, you'll be spending a lot of time figuring out which stats to improve in the character screen.[/b]

----

Strength - This dictates how much damage you do, and along with that, most pieces of armor and weapons need a good strength level to be used.

----

Dexterity - Both improves your attacking rating and your defense rating, a higher dexterity means you will hit more often, and enemies will hit less often. Many weapons need a good dexterity rating.

----

Vitality - This is your overall health count, while you do slowly gain health as you level, upgrading your vitality will improve your overall health level heavily.

----

Energy - Deciding how much mana you have, which spells and skills use as you cast them, also decides how fast your mana regenerates.

----

Your skills vary from spells that cause big booms, give bonuses to your health, improve defense, allows you to hit more than one enemy at once with your weapon, and etc. each character has a unique set of thirty skills, and choosing the right skills and finding ones that benefit eachother are a large part of the game.
Diablo 2 has the prerequisite monster loots, item drops, and armor. Each piece of armor or every weapon has a different look, so your character will almost never look the same as another one.

Diablo 2 and its expansion pack Lord of Destruction, feature seven character classes, every single one is extremely different, attributing to different speed, health, endurance, and unique skill trees.
The classes are as follows.

----

Paladin - A "holy warrior" the Paladin has the ability to use auras that benefit him and his party, he excels against undead enemies, and is an even mix of defensive and offensive power.

----

Sorceress - The Sorceress focuses on spells, and in return for her massive firepower, she is quite weak in close combat. Although she makes up for this with very powerful elemental spells that range from exploding fireballs to arching lightning. She focuses on spells, so her mana is higher than most.

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/1681/screenshot013sy1.th.jpg (http://img81.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot013sy1.jpg)
Spells like Meteor (shown here) are only a few of the powerful spells available to the Sorceress.[/b]

----

Barbarian - The Barbarian is completely combat focused, so as one would expect, he doesn't have many spells or much mana. His skills focus on passive abilities that boost his abilities in combat, or just make him far tougher. He also has various combat skills that allow him to mow down enemies easily.

----

Amazon - One of the most versatile characters in the game, she is combat focused, but unlike the Barbarian, she relies on speed and dexterity. She can use a bow, javeling, or spear very well, and her skills allow her to use all of those weapons to their full extent.

----

Necromancer - For those that like to have others do the work for them, the Necromancer can summon undead allies and golems that will destroy his enemies. He also has curses which weakens enemies and boosts his powers. He also has quite some offensive powers with various powerful magical attacks. He's very frail in close combat, and relies on his minions and long ranged magic attacks to defeat his enemies.

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/2715/screenshot001us8.th.jpg (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot001us8.jpg)
Here my Necromancer displays how devastating an army of skeletal minions can be.[/b]
----

Assassin - The Assassin is a mix of magic, and dexterious combat. Her skills rely on taking down enemies quickly with very powerful attacks, and her traps and martial arts moves all defeat enemies in large waves. While she is quite powerful in the damage department, she is frail, and makes up with this with high damage and speed.

----

Druid - The more combat worthy version of the Necromancer. His animal companions are lesser in numbers, but stronger and some give boosts to one's party. His elemental skills are powerful, but take up large amounts of mana. The Druid uses his shapeshifting skills to defeat enemies in close combat, making him a fine balance of all skills.

----

With all this variety and potential to create whichever type of character you want. Diablo 2 does exceptionally well in the gameplay department.

But despite that, Diablo 2's graphics are quite dated. Even for its time, Diablo was quite drab and bland compared to its counterparts, but it makes up for this with pure gorgeous spell effects. LoD introduces a better resolution, so all the nice lighting effects can be used to their full effect. The visuals in Diablo 2 won't amaze, but they're adequate, and the spell effects are quite nice.

Following that, the sound is great. Each item has an audibly drop, and after awhile, you can tell which item dropped just from the sound it makes. The tinging of a jewel, the thunk of a club, or the metalic clang of armor. The surroundings are atmospheric, and the soundtrack is phenomenal.
Creatures create audable noise, monsters growl behind corners, and spell effects make huge explosions and electrical noise.
The voice acting is exceptional, and each character has a memorable quality because of the pure excellence of the voice acting.

Sound will not dissapoint in Diablo 2.

Diablo II has a massive arsenal of weaponry, armor, helms, amulets, rings, boots, gloves and etc. To create a even larger variety of items, each item comes in a different style, including, normal, socketed, magic, rare, unique and set item. A normal item is exactly that, normal, no added bonuses, interesting effects, or anything else, just a plain item, while magic items usually have a few extra magical abilities. Rare items take the idea of magic items, and expand them, while you'll never find the same rare item twice, certain rare items can be quite powerful, usually containing a large amount of magical bonuses. Unique items though, are incredibly difficult to find, and are usually worth the while, uniques can be incredibly powerful, or provide great defense for your character. Last but CERTAINLY not least, Set items are items that belong to a certain "group" for example, the set "Artic Gear" has a suit of armor, a belt, a bow, and a pair of boots, when worn by themselves, they can hardly be considered more powerful than the lowest of uniques, but when set items are worn with other items of the same set, they give major bonuses, once a complete set has been collected and equipped, you receive massive bonuses. This causes reason for celebration when you find that little set item you've been looking for all along.

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/4168/screenshot004zs7.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot004zs7.jpg)
On display here is Skullder's Ire, a rather powerful Unique item.[/b]

If you get bored of the Singeplayer, Diablo 2 presents you with an excellent multiplayer mode. Like most games, there's a lobby, and you join whichever game you wish. Quests and the such are handled appropriatly. You can team up with other members, and quests and experience are properly handled between your party members.

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/7884/screenshot015dg0.th.jpg (http://img227.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot015dg0.jpg)
Joining a party is one of the many highlights playing online, as shown here.[/b]

As you would expect, characters compliment eachother quite well, and having a good party combination is important to success against your enemies. There's nothing more fun than trading, dueling, or defeating monsters with others, and Diablo 2's multiplayer will keep your busy for a long time.

So if you're looking for something that will keep you busy for a long, long time. Diablo 2 is the game to pick up. If you don't already own this addictive masterpiece, you have something great missing from your collection. If you play it for the Singeplayer, the Multiplayer, or both, Diablo 2 and its expansion are an absolute must.

The Fifth Horseman
28-08-2006, 01:29 PM
A good, informative and most importantly, true to the point review. Congrats.

Eagle of Fire
29-08-2006, 03:15 AM
Well, not 100% true... Diablo II is not a RPG. :wallbash:

troop18546
29-08-2006, 01:02 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eagle of Fire @ Aug 29 2006, 06:15 AM) 251570</div>
Well, not 100% true... Diablo II is not a RPG. :wallbash:
[/b]

LOL, true to some extent but not definately.
BTW, BP, that's a very good review :ok: .

Also, I need my Skullders back now plz. :D :D :D

The Fifth Horseman
29-08-2006, 01:40 PM
Blood-Piggy has explained his view on the situation in the first paragraph of the text.
Somewhere in the RPG genre, there is a line. This line seperates the complex and story oriented RPGs from the action based gameplay oriented RPGs. While gaming snobs constantly attempt to discredit the latter, their attempts fall flat, as while the deep and complex RPGs usually deliver quite well, it never stacks up to the pure addictive qualities of the other side of the line, the action oriented RPG.[/b]
Suffice to say, he has a point.

Eagle of Fire
30-08-2006, 02:25 AM
No, he doesn't. He's right in the most part, but then fall for the same argument everyone use. The truth is that Diablo II is an action game with some very minor RPG elements mixed in.

If I make a cake and add some chocolate toping, it's a cake with chocolate toping. If I add a single cherry on the top, it's a cake with chocolate toping with a single cherry on the top, not a chocolate and cherry cake.

The RPG element of Diablo II is extremely minor, to the point that it's almost non existant. You can't claim that the whole game is an RPG when it doesn't even cover 10% of the game. And I'm feeling generous on the 10%.

_r.u.s.s.
30-08-2006, 08:42 AM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eagle of Fire @ Aug 30 2006, 02:25 AM) 251771</div>
If I make a cake and add some chocolate toping, it's a cake with chocolate toping. If I add a single cherry on the top, it's a cake with chocolate toping with a single cherry on the top, not a chocolate and cherry cake.
[/b]
well, i think there are like more "cherryes" in diablo actually..
so it can be cherry/chocolate cake

Blood-Pigggy
30-08-2006, 08:09 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eagle of Fire @ Aug 29 2006, 10:25 PM) 251771</div>
No, he doesn't. He's right in the most part, but then fall for the same argument everyone use. The truth is that Diablo II is an action game with some very minor RPG elements mixed in.

If I make a cake and add some chocolate toping, it's a cake with chocolate toping. If I add a single cherry on the top, it's a cake with chocolate toping with a single cherry on the top, not a chocolate and cherry cake.

The RPG element of Diablo II is extremely minor, to the point that it's almost non existant. You can't claim that the whole game is an RPG when it doesn't even cover 10% of the game. And I'm feeling generous on the 10%.
[/b]

Personally, I think you should stop, seriously, take a deep breath, instead of crapping your pants over nothing, stop being so defensive, yeesh, "no he doesn't" you're being such a snob, I DO have a point, I'm smart enough to see that, and I'm smart enough to let people have their own opinion, unlike you.

Fortunatly, I'm not too narrow-sighted and neither am I a mindless worm to conform to what everyone accepts as a genre, it's a generality, I ask "Do you see the forest?" and you say "No, there are too many trees in the way" loosen up, I don't have to listen to what you say, and because of that, there's no more point to bring your flaming with a sweet caramel layer on top to this thread as well.

Eagle of Fire
31-08-2006, 02:06 AM
You're the only one who see me as angry or flaming here Blood-Pigggy. If you've read what I said in the past year(s), you know where I stand on this. I always said and will always continue to say that Diablo II is not an RPG, because it's the truth. You can fall in the game of the big companies who flagged the game only with marketing in mind, I do not. I call things like they are, and it's really not because I don't know what I'm talking about. I have the game here with the expention, and I still play it to this day. I wasted countless hours on it, just like you probably did too, and I know just like you what you can do in the game.

All I'm doing here is camping on my position since several years. If someone needs to take a small break and "loosen up", it's probably more yourself. You made a very good review and I guess you think that I'm here to bash it, but it's really not the case and we're really not talking about that right now.

The Fifth Horseman
31-08-2006, 10:14 AM
Eagle, please do not fight over this. If you trace the entire discussion back to beginning , it was you who started a verbal attack simply because Piggy stated his opinion on the subject.

Let's make it clear: you both have your opinions, both justified from your points of view.

Acknowledge the fact that the other side is entitled to their own opinion, and let's get this over with. I am not going to allow any sort of verbal fight to continue in here.

gregor
02-09-2006, 07:27 AM
It seems to me we need another review then.

Personally i take RPG as a game where you can develope and shape the character in the way you please. And that is what you do in Diablo. Sure there are limitations to it and to what extent you can actually shape your character. It's not like in Morrowind or maybe UW where you can basically define the character through gameplay. Here much is predefined, but there is still a lot is left for you to define. example you are limited by spells and alike for example for sorceress. but it is still your choice if she will be skilled in fire, ice or lightning. in that way you can shape the character. you can also choose the equipment you will cary. and since space is limited you have to again give a personal touch to it. will it be the staff weilding expert or maybe the sword is weapon of choice etc.

It's a role, you play it and it's a game - RPG. :D

Dave
08-09-2006, 08:34 AM
I'm gonna stop playing it...but only when Diablo III will born!! :brain:

I really hope it. :unsure:

troop18546
09-09-2006, 07:20 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(David86 @ Sep 8 2006, 11:34 AM) 253613</div>
I'm gonna stop playing it...but only when Diablo III will born!! :brain:

I really hope it. :unsure:
[/b]

Well, it took them from 1994 to 2000 to make a sequel, so it should've been out by 2006 if planned, but given the Expansion in 2001, I'd say wait for 2007. I don't think it will ever be out, cause the story ended at Expansion's end.

Vendermarch
09-09-2006, 10:00 PM
I think that Diablo 2, although VERY action oriented is still RPG. Take Eye of the Beholder for example. In Diablo 2 there's arguably more role playing than in EOB :) But enough of that. Everything was said already.

Now any ideas where could story of Diablo 3 possibly lead? :ph34r:

troop18546
10-09-2006, 01:43 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Vendermarch @ Sep 10 2006, 01:00 AM) 254050</div>
I think that Diablo 2, although VERY action oriented is still RPG. Take Eye of the Beholder for example. In Diablo 2 there's arguably more role playing than in EOB :) But enough of that. Everything was said already.

Now any ideas where could story of Diablo 3 possibly lead? :ph34r:
[/b]

Well, to the life on Earth after the Worldstone's destruction. Story could be told by Tyrael.
I had thought about this:
Much like in Painkiller, the lesser evils absorb the power of the prime evils and start to take hold of power among heaven themselves. They corrupt angels and such, bending them to their will. The boss fights could be much like the Ancients. Will 3 to 5 enemy bosses (depending on difficulty level). And so on...

I'd like a trading center of all known items to be available for sale. One's could be sold, other's given for completing tasks or dueling some boss or npc. Other items could have a few (3) known locations and certain reward could be given for getting them back to merchants (unless the player decides to keep them).

BTW, they should really fix dupe-bugs.

Blood-Pigggy
10-09-2006, 05:54 PM
Um, the Lesser Evils are all dead.

Vendermarch
10-09-2006, 06:01 PM
And not to mention how many times they died to date :D

I think that Blizzard will think about something more epic. Destruction of Worldstone won't be unadressed imo

troop18546
11-09-2006, 12:11 PM
OMG, such noobs.

The Dark Exile
"Seven is the number of the powers of Hell, and Seven is the number of the Great Evils."

Duriel, the Lord Of Pain
Andariel, the Maiden of Anguish
Belial, Lord of Lies
Azmodan, the Lord of Sin

Mephisto, the Lord of Hatred
Baal, the Lord of Destruction
Diablo, the Lord of Terror

The one's in bold never werenever used in the game. Pfff... Just read the script... :whistling:

Blood-Pigggy
11-09-2006, 07:15 PM
Erm, perhaps you didn't read the part in the original game where they were "Cast out from Hell and destroyed for treason?"

They died LONG before Diablo even came to earth in the original.

troop18546
12-09-2006, 12:28 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Blood-Pigggy @ Sep 11 2006, 10:15 PM) 254482</div>
Erm, perhaps you didn't read the part in the original game where they were "Cast out from Hell and destroyed for treason?"

They died LONG before Diablo even came to earth in the original.
[/b]

I read all, there wasn't any mention of this. Maybe I forgot, damn. :tai:

Eagle of Fire
12-09-2006, 11:26 PM
That's why you should never start posts with something similar to OMG, such noobs. [/b]

As you can see, it can easily turn around and hit you hard in the face. ;)

Ioncannon
13-09-2006, 01:01 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(troop18546 @ Sep 11 2006, 12:11 PM) 254381</div>
OMG, such noobs.

The Dark Exile
"Seven is the number of the powers of Hell, and Seven is the number of the Great Evils."

Duriel, the Lord Of Pain
Andariel, the Maiden of Anguish
Belial, Lord of Lies
Azmodan, the Lord of Sin

Mephisto, the Lord of Hatred
Baal, the Lord of Destruction
Diablo, the Lord of Terror

The one's in bold never werenever used in the game. Pfff... Just read the script... :whistling:
[/b]

Belial, Lord of Lies the use him in the Diablo book. He is summoned by a evil commander, with the help of a demon, to sacrafice his soilders, and turn them into monsters. He then tries to retrieve Bartuc's armour to become the new blood warlord.

troop18546
13-09-2006, 06:30 PM
LOL, ok ok, no need to RE-point that out for me, jeeez.
Altho I still ain't very convinced but this is a bit :offtopic: .

Vendermarch
13-09-2006, 07:20 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(troop18546 @ Sep 13 2006, 08:30 PM) 254827</div>
LOL, ok ok, no need to RE-point that out for me, jeeez.
Altho I still ain't very convinced but this is a bit :offtopic: .
[/b]

Is it? What's wrong with discussing the game that has been reviewed?

Anyways I think that with Diablo being dead they have 2 options. Either ressurect him in some obscure way, or make a plot based on something else. The latter is just not right, with the game called Diablo and all. I'm really anxious to see what they will come up with.

troop18546
14-09-2006, 01:37 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Vendermarch @ Sep 13 2006, 10:20 PM) 254833</div>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(troop18546 @ Sep 13 2006, 08:30 PM) 254827
LOL, ok ok, no need to RE-point that out for me, jeeez.
Altho I still ain't very convinced but this is a bit :offtopic: .
[/b]

Is it? What's wrong with discussing the game that has been reviewed?

Anyways I think that with Diablo being dead they have 2 options. Either ressurect him in some obscure way, or make a plot based on something else. The latter is just not right, with the game called Diablo and all. I'm really anxious to see what they will come up with.
[/b][/quote]

Well, the DIII trailer citation:

"Over eons, the world has faced evil and vanquished it in the end, but Diablo just kept coming back... and coming back... AND COMING BACK :titan: "

LOL

chainsoar
14-09-2006, 02:39 PM
I actually just purchased a copy of this game a week or so ago, never played it before that. I used to play a pirated copy of Diablo 1 my brother got off his friend and I'll always remember it fondly. Diablo 2, I'm glad to discover, rocks my socks equally.

hassaland
09-11-2006, 11:30 PM
i grew with diablo,for me d2 is a dream
diablo 3 in 2008???(good,just wait...1 year and some months)




i found only 1
screenshot of d3,seems nice...

JoM
21-11-2006, 12:29 AM
Great review; I could really feel the enthusiasm you have for the game. Just one thing, though, you have omitted my the best, and certainly my favourite, game mode: hardcore.

The added edge of having a character deleted permanently if it dies really provides an extra adrenaline boost if your character drops down to, say, below 20% health.

Otherwise, a very competant and comprehensive review.

Titan
21-11-2006, 01:21 PM
IMHO Diablo2 got screwed over with the expantion, as Assasin makes it just too easy.

Assasin + Fire-trap = easiest win you'll ever have in the game.

Saphire
21-11-2006, 01:53 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Titan @ Nov 21 2006, 03:21 PM) 267998</div>
IMHO Diablo2 got screwed over with the expantion, as Assasin makes it just too easy.

Assasin + Fire-trap = easiest win you'll ever have in the game.
[/b]
I'm afraid you're wrong, Titan, or you never played Assasine with fire traps in difficulty Hell. With the many immunes there she loses hopelessly. Better already is an Assasine with the lightning traps, there're less lightning immunes in key areas, and the rest is handled by the Shadow Master.
The easiest win you'll ever have in the game can be archieved with a Paladin who uses the skill Smite, this one is simply overpowered. Or one who casts Blessed Hammer, called Hammerdin. Both are the strongest builds in the expansion games.

troop18546
21-11-2006, 07:35 PM
The game is COMPLETELY bugged. That's why we see ppl completing Baal in hell in 5secs (as Scatty done it :P).

Titan
21-11-2006, 09:56 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Saphire @ Nov 21 2006, 03:53 PM) 268009</div>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Titan @ Nov 21 2006, 03:21 PM) 267998
IMHO Diablo2 got screwed over with the expantion, as Assasin makes it just too easy.

Assasin + Fire-trap = easiest win you'll ever have in the game.
[/b]
I'm afraid you're wrong, Titan, or you never played Assasine with fire traps in difficulty Hell. With the many immunes there she loses hopelessly. Better already is an Assasine with the lightning traps, there're less lightning immunes in key areas, and the rest is handled by the Shadow Master.
The easiest win you'll ever have in the game can be archieved with a Paladin who uses the skill Smite, this one is simply overpowered. Or one who casts Blessed Hammer, called Hammerdin. Both are the strongest builds in the expansion games.
[/b][/quote]

Yepp. Both traps are overpowerd.

Smite is "old" and the hammer.. well, since it's resonaly highlevel, i'd guess i wouldn't call it OVERpowerd.

nirvrex
23-07-2007, 03:13 PM
is this a new thing? because when I used to play a couple years ago, nobody was callin the pally overpowered

Dave
23-07-2007, 03:21 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mr's O'versanne @ Nov 10 2006, 02:30 AM) 266214</div>
i grew with diablo,for me d2 is a dream
diablo 3 in 2008???(good,just wait...1 year and some months)
[/b]

Probably Diablo 3 will never be published...
(maybe something online like WOW, but I don't think so)

Man_of_Mystery
24-07-2007, 12:18 AM
blizzard seems to be focusing on JUST the new starcraft game right now, so I don't see a new Diablo game being made in the near future

12turtle12
26-07-2007, 06:29 PM
LOL at this thread. Pretty good review so kudos to Blood Piggy, give him a nickel or something!
I do have to say at least the friendly flamer lives up to his name (as in the definition on wikipedia that 5th sent me a couple days ago, not flamer as in slang for "***") - but IMHO, which differs from his, I would say it is an RPG since yes, it's not turn-based but there is enough open-ended character development from 3 skill trees for each of 7 characters, all of which are so completely different, that I would label it an RPG.

The first time I was introduced to Diablo 1 I was about 15 or so and I hit the eject button on the cd-rom drive, forgot about it, and proceeded to roll my chair through it, breaking the cd rom drive. And it was my friend's computer...ouch.

Diablo 2 I was thrilled about, so maybe my opinion is biased for it because I still like it and play it A LOT - but like I said, just because it doesn't seem traditional, old-school, turn-based RPG, you can still mark many of the characters like you would old D&D warriors, wizards, etc. That's RPG to me.

edit-BTW, I'm very interested to know how to kill Baal in 5 seconds on Hell...

Nick
27-07-2007, 08:45 AM
Stupid game. Develops munchkinism. :angry:

But I got on it recently too. :)

And, yes, Necromancer rules. I think I found winning class in this damn game.

12turtle12
27-07-2007, 03:25 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Nick @ Jul 27 2007, 08:45 AM) 301533</div>
Stupid game. Develops munchkinism. :angry:

But I got on it recently too. :)

And, yes, Necromancer rules. I think I found winning class in this damn game.
[/b]

Munchkinism???

edit- Some day I will just look at wikipedia before I ask anything. Munchkinism - yes, D2 has PLENTY of that.
"Hey I have a level 20 character! I will fight your lvl 12!" *dies in one hit* WTF? "Oh, I forgot to tellyou my lvl 12 has the magical sword of kicking your arse any time I want" --- "yeah, that ones' pretty powerful. you got pwned. *sshole."

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 06:55 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Nick @ Jul 27 2007, 04:45 AM) 301533</div>
Stupid game. Develops munchkinism. :angry:

But I got on it recently too. :)

And, yes, Necromancer rules. I think I found winning class in this damn game.
[/b]

There's no winning class, they're all equally good.

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 07:04 PM
thats even theoreticaly impossible in the world

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 07:36 PM
Whatever, Blizzard balanced them perfectly and the only people that say a certain class is better than the other is a person that doesn't know how to use that class.

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 07:38 PM
the thing what i said was, that blizzard couldnt balance them perfectly
and btw how do you think there would be 1.21b patch for warcraft right now..

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 07:40 PM
What!?

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 07:42 PM
that it was unbalanced and thats why they make the patches \D:/ (and bug fixes)

12turtle12
27-07-2007, 07:45 PM
Just about any good game, especially online capable, have patches. It's because the company that owns it knows that there are "munchkin" types out there. I've played a few different single player games that I'll only use 1,2or3 powers because they're so much better than the others. I just re-installed Diablo 2 three days ago and had to dl the patches for it again (took an extra 5 or 10 minutes)

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 09:00 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(_r.u.s.s. @ Jul 27 2007, 03:42 PM) 301633</div>
that it was unbalanced and thats why they make the patches \D:/ (and bug fixes)
[/b]

No... most of the time it's insignificant changes, such as certain units, but every race had overpowered units, Blizzard never has any major balance issues. The races were always balanced, Blizzard just tried to perfect it.

No races were EVER unbalanced.

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 09:45 PM
first of all, you said balanced 'perfectly', thats why i said its impossible. and of course there are just minor changes. but i have played warcraft (thats a blizzard game..) and they almost always changed HP for different units and manacosts of spells, so players who played it seriously would need to get used to new rules. i dont know how is it with diablo 2 since i didnt play it that much, just few times with friend and finished hell. but i bet there were more unbalanced units on begining than now

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 10:07 PM
Actually no, the beginning tends to be better on most games, those alterations usually don't work as well.

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 10:13 PM
lоl, why would they release patches then. seems it does give sence for pro players

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 10:14 PM
The main reasons of patches is to fix bugs, not to alter the game.

Your definition of patches is very wrong.

12turtle12
27-07-2007, 10:19 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Blood-Pigggy @ Jul 27 2007, 10:14 PM) 301654</div>
The main reasons of patches is to fix bugs, not to alter the game.

Your definition of patches is very wrong.
[/b]

BP, patches DO alter the game. Both statements CAN be true! Take for instance the Paladin in D2. I believe it was the smite ability that was "bugged" and overpowered. They "fixed" it, which "altered" the gameplay of the paladin character. If you mean it doesn't alter the game by making a HUGE change like removing characters or whatever, then sure, you're right. BUt a patch does alter the game, even if it's not a gigantic all-consuming change.

_r.u.s.s.
27-07-2007, 10:21 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Blood-Pigggy @ Jul 28 2007, 12:14 AM) 301654</div>
The main reasons of patches is to fix bugs, not to alter the game.

Your definition of patches is very wrong.
[/b]
no.. its also cause of game balance-_- not only bug fixes (which i mentioned too). on begining its like they patch main bugs and then later on it comes more closer to game balance

Blood-Pigggy
27-07-2007, 11:13 PM
BS, changing the gameplay in patches is a poor practice that shouldn't be done by any developer, and most don't.

These things never really change the game for better, unless it's simply adding a feature, like multiplayer in System Shock 2 or Skirmish in Freedom Force, patches should never really alter anything beyond bugs.

A developer should take the time to balance the game before hand, it's idiotic to add patches that alter the balance of a game afterwards, that's lazy and dumb, bugs are excusable to a certain degree, poor balancing is not.

12turtle12
27-07-2007, 11:24 PM
The problem is, a game developer, and the beta testers too, cannot find everything wrong with the game. You don't always have 1000 people testing a game (actually...almost never) Starcraft had patches that dealt w/ unit costs, D2 had patches that dealt w/ over-powered or underpowered powers (LOL). Sometimes it takes 10,000 people buying a game and playing it 20 hours a day to find certain strategies that work. Sometimes those strategies are just cheap, or over-powered, and no one in testing used that particular unit or ability in that way. Wikipedia sez:
Because the word "patch" carries the connotation of a small fix, large fixes may use different nomenclature. Bulky patches or patches that significantly change a program may circulate as "service packs" or as "software updates". Microsoft Windows NT and its successors (including Windows 2000, Windows XP, and later versions) use the "service pack" terminology.

In several Unix-like systems, particularly Linux, updates between releases are delivered as new software packages. These updates are in the same format as the original installation so they can be used either to update an existing package in-place (effectively patching) or be used directly for new installations.

So maybe literally "patch" could mean a small bug fix, but according to this it "may use different nomenclature". So, it's not always the case. A "patch" COULD be something big. It seems to depend on the developer/distributor/owner/etc

Falls
03-08-2007, 03:05 AM
Really, an RPG is a Role Playing Game, so, though I may be inexperienced, it seems to me a triviality that Diablo is action oriented. Is a child with ADD still a child?

Nick
05-08-2007, 10:33 AM
That's good point and I agree, but MANY people here don't. :)

Geckotide
06-08-2007, 08:14 AM
Oh, I remember playing this on the PS! I used to love it! I'll have to get it again. Nice review, very informative :ok:

12turtle12
08-08-2007, 06:19 PM
You are thinking of Diablo 1 for the PS - #2 was only released PC if I am correct.

Not sure if this should go here, perhaps I should open up a new topic, but it's a quick question - Has anybody played Sacred? Does anyone know if anybody still plays it multiplayer? I went to a server and it was EMPTY

skaven510
09-08-2007, 07:12 AM
I had no idea they had Diablo on the PS. Was it any good? Couldn't of been easy switching spells on a console.

12turtle12
09-08-2007, 04:21 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(skaven510 @ Aug 9 2007, 07:12 AM) 303803</div>
I had no idea they had Diablo on the PS. Was it any good? Couldn't of been easy switching spells on a console.
[/b]

I don't think it was bad at all. That's actually how I was introduced to the series. I abused the heck out of glitches LOL

12turtle12
12-08-2007, 05:10 AM
BTW (Couple Days Later...) - I am replaying w/ combinations I have not used before -
all-summong druid w/ that cyclone elemental power
assasin w/ martial arts almost exclusively
Necromancer w/ only summoning powers
It's definitely a bit different than what I'm used to playing. Anybody have anything they've used that they thought was fun?
edit- has anybody else noticed that the title of this thread is wrong? Any way to change it to Diablo II ? It's bugging me. LOL

Tomekk
27-09-2008, 09:45 AM
This is seriously one of the best games ever made.
It has an amazing replay value, with lots of different classes to master. The graphics we're very detailed for there time, and was a better choice then 3D back then.
For those who say this is not an RPG, you're definetly wrong. Just because it has a weaker story and less strategy in it, doesn't mean it's an RPG. It has a whole bunch of RPG elements actually: Your character and every item in the game was a whole bunch of stats, there's a whole bunch of enemies,each with different weaknesses, and don't forget the bosses :D
The multiplayer is also great. You can easily form a party and just go own some monsters.

Balthasar
28-09-2008, 08:21 AM
For those who say this is not an RPG, you're definetly wrong. Just because it has a weaker story and less strategy in it, doesn't mean it's an RPG. It has a whole bunch of RPG elements actually:

Hmm..i never played Diablo II, so i can only refer to what Blood-Pigggy is writing in his (btw really good) review. But i played the first part of it and i can say the following:

I started playing it and came into this little village. After some few minutes i came into the dungeon. I said to myself "OK, lets get to this evil monster here, bring back some treasures and become more experience. This is the first dungeon so i guess i'm out here before lunch."..Uhh what a mistake. After i came to the 10th level (or so) i slowly realised, that this will be the hole game. Hack'n Slash till the very end. No NPC's with quests to solve, no party of characters, no real puzzles, no land to discover and a minimum of skills to build up. Seriously, this is not the type of "RPG" that i prefer, even though it might be a good action game.

Your character and every item in the game was a whole bunch of stats, there's a whole bunch of enemies,each with different weaknesses, and don't forget the bosses

That might be true but a RPG is a bit more in my opinion. Think of great RPG's like Might & Magic, Baldurs Gate or The Dark Eye. Those RPG's had some major things in common: The freedom to explore your world, the freedom to choose the way in which order you want to do this, the many attributes (like skills and race) of your characters which make them a true individual and last but not least a good story behind the game itself. So in my opinion Diablo has nothing to do with a good RPG.

Greets B.

Blood-Pigggy
28-09-2008, 05:22 PM
Diablo is a throwback to Rogue and is definitely an RPG, you can debate on the sub-genres all you want, but if Planescape: Torment with its utter lack of non-linearity, completely arbitrary character development and rather vapid and generic quest structure is an RPG, then so is the Diablo series.

Rogue-likes are older than most "original" RPGs anyway.

Tomekk
28-09-2008, 05:31 PM
Agreed. Many people also call Zelda an RPG, and if you thought Diablo wasn't look at those game.(I'm not saying that there bad just barely any RPG elements at all!)

To tell you the truth, the reason I don't like turn-based RPGs, is becuase they are long and boring. In Diablo all you need is your faithful mouse and just kill 100s of monsters as quick as saying "Blood Pigggy wrote a very good review" :P

Ohh and Piggy I subscired an added you to my firneds list on Youtube. :thumbs:

Blood-Pigggy
28-09-2008, 06:15 PM
I love turn-based RPGs, and I don't see the Zelda series as an RPG series, I just think those are misinformed people.

And I wrote this review a long time ago when I was younger and my writing skills weren't up to snuff, I can do a lot better, in fact, I was writing an Oblivion review a few seconds ago before FireFox's stupid ass fucking shortcuts caused me to exit out of it with no progress saved.

The only reason most people don't see Diablo II as an RPG is because of the elitist effect, they don't think hack & slash games are RPGs, and they'd be the first to tell you that Greyhawk Temple of Elemental Evil and Icewind Dale are less RPGs than Planescape: Torment or The Witcher, because they're the sort of people that don't understand the roots of this genre and only concern themselves with "deep" and "complex" games, which in reality are really games with gameplay made for babies. Somehow the whole concept of a complex story and choice and consequence makes a game a complex RPG.

Balthasar
29-09-2008, 07:55 PM
but if Planescape: Torment with its utter lack of non-linearity, completely arbitrary character development and rather vapid and generic quest structure is an RPG, then so is the Diablo series.

To tell the truth...Planescape Torment disappointed me much. It is a RPG but a crappy one in my opinion.

Icewind Dale are less RPGs than Planescape: Torment

I wouldn't say so. Icewind Dale isn't that great like Baldurs Gate (if you want to compare similar games) but it is way better than Planescape.

because they're the sort of people that don't understand the roots of this genre and only concern themselves with "deep" and "complex" games, which in reality are really games with gameplay made for babies

Hmm, maybe i don't know the roots too. I started off with games like Eye of the Beyholder or Clouds of Xeen and that sort of games somehow coined me. As i first played Diablo I i missed all these things i had in those games. So that's why i wouldn't call it a RPG. But ppl can call it that way either. I don't mind. In the end it's just a word and i think everybody will fill it out with its own meaning. I like the "deep" and "complex" baby-style way :bleh:

twillight
17-01-2011, 12:16 PM
This game is one of the biggest failures in the entire gaming-history.

First: although most refer this as an RPG, it is not at all an RPG. It offers absolutly no choice in the story, or any of the quests, heck, even when the expansion came out the quests had to be done in an absolute order, or you simply could never done what you skipped!

Of course there are theoretically almost endless ways to create a character. In reality it is not so. With every patch only a half dozen character were able to progress on its own, or be useful in party to the end. Two, maybe three builds in all characterclasses. and even after 13 main patches, some skills were still never an option.

Now back to the field of the quests: half of the "quests" aren't even quests, but things you'll have to do to progress. Like any last quest is "kill the actboss". Reward? There is none. And there are even quests, what are same as other quests - nothing separates them, there is no extra reward, no nothing. A complete failure.

The gameplay is actually simple hack&slash, with only the minimal variety of monsters. And advenced players will simply skip the monsters with any uniquesness, because they don't give what this game only can offer: experience. Of course you'll never progress to the maximum level anymore. Blizzard made it so hard and insanly repetitive, that you simply won't do it. No idea why they didn't simply lowered the level-limit...

Oh, the game theoretically offers countless items to. Also not in reality, as the only items you'll want are certain unique and set items (the set bonuses not worth it, so just think on 'em like unique items with different coloured names), no variety. Heck, there are items what 99% of the players will wear, no matter what build or charactercalss they have. Now also these items are hard to come by. A good amount of the items are not even avaiable anywhere else, but the final boss! And the rest have also so low chance being dropped, that you won't simply care. There goes your items.

The battle itself is simple. You hack&slash with two buttons, before the first strike changing with the hotkeys to the appropriate two skill if necessary. Some characters never even change their two ability. The progress is highly repetitive, because the levels are either insainly long with zillion of monsters (like Act3), or too short with only a few monsters so you'll have to go through the entire act again and again countless times just to reach the level necessary for the next act (like Act4).
Oh, battle-difficulty: it is as simple as this: you either kill or be killed. You don't have MAXIMUM resitances? You'll die, no matter your skills. You don't have the required level? You'll die, no matter your skills. You don't have the advenced item in one of your slots? In the best scenario 8if the items is a weapon) you'll simply not be able to kill anything.

Now the actual gameplay is all about gathering equipment to be able to kill more monsters. To get those equipments needed for that, you need to kill more monsters. Quests? Quests are rare, fixed, and don't give exp, and you're fortunate if they give any kind of reward at all (half of them won't).
Now killing monsters simply won't just work. You'll have to kill SPECIFIC monsters! Over and over again. And they are hard to reach,even when you're invincible you'll have to spend countless hours just to walk through that damned dungeon fnding the damned enterance to that damned monster that has 0.01% chance dropping the item you NEED.

And it is even worse in multiplayer. There the maps are not fixed, so you'll have to spend even more time finding that exit to that monster you want to kill for item. and after you have all items, you'll have to kill again the same monsters for specific key-items to unlock the multiplayre option's only addition: a superfight agains more bloody monsters. What yu kill for more items. And you'll do this countless other times to get the item for you, and the item in perfect condition.

Well, to be honest, you most probably won't kill any monsters, nor looking for equipments in the multiplayer after the first hour. Why? Because you'll be rushed to the very end of the entire game with a measily level 1 character. And as you see that everyone uses cheats, abuses bugs, uses programs to do the item-search and leveling up, hunting you down (with help of programs) and stealing from you, you'll simply turn off the game, or buy the stuff you want, and play alone behinde passworded games - in multiplayer.

Now ontu the statistics, if you are still interrested in this horrible game:
Strenght's only reason is to wear items. Not a single player invest into strenght.
Energy is the joke-stat of Diablo 2. It is there, but noone knows why. You simply never need to invest a single point into this. Oh, there is 1,and only one skill that'd make worth putting points into energy, but since 13 main patches there is a bug that prevents making it to any use.
Dexterity depends on wether you use a shield to block or not., If not, it is like strenght, though most equipments have no DEX-requirement. If you have shield, you go for the aximum amount of block - noone invest any more points then this. Forget about the defense-stat, as it can not realisticly rised ontu a useful level.
Vitality where all the rest of the points go.

Now the bugs as I mentioned them just above: this game has the longest bug-list ever, and every patch just enlargened that. Darn, it is almost as long as the bugs and problems with Windows! there are ca. 200 known bugs, not involving balance-issues, 66% of them identified (nd in mods corrected) by players, half of them being simple typos (one character mistyped). Some of these bugs are in there since 1.00 (like the infamous manaburn bug, what causes and monster with manadrain ability stealing thousand times more mana then they should, causing all your mana disappear even from the weakest of monsters to the strongest of character - all that because of a simple typo).

Balance again is not strong point of this game. Some builds and abilities simply overrule any other possbility. Oh well, maybe you can crawl through the game with an amazon holding lance, but why do it, when with javelins you are a thousand times more efficient?
Not to mention entire abilitytabs, entire builds are not useable. Like Summon Druid. Or Martial Arts assassin. If you choose skills from those tabs as main skill, you'll be stuck soner or later in the game, no exception.

Also the synergie-system introduced in 1.10 is a total failure. The synergies many times don't strenghten each other to any useable level, require too many points to be efficient even for the basics, and Blizzard connected this way the wrong skills almost all times.

Sounds: is there music?